300 Norma vs 300 RUM

[Ryan Avery]

My most accurate rifle is a second hand Savage in 7RM. Maybe the .284 bullet is the accurate part? Plus, they kill elk like lightning.

Do you think it would knock down bigfoot like lightning?

 

[Matt Cashell]

Do you think it would knock down bigfoot like lightning?

Think?

 

[Ryan Avery]

Think?

Bigfoot?
Lightning?
7RM?


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[Wrench]

With the current trend in scopes, ballistic calculators and bullets.....I'm seeing fine results by slowing down a match bullet and smashing it exactly where I want it.

If you want to slow it down with less powder or an extra 600 yards....whatever.

We're at a point where any rifle headstamp can tip elk over to pretty close to a grand without question, thanks to bullets with incredibly low drag and the smorgasbord of tools to help us learn how to steer it.

At the end of the day what'd another 400fps buy you that your elevation turret couldn't?

 

[HellsCanyon]

I’ve built a few Norma’s. It’s suffered from a lack of quality brass available. Peterson or Lapua brass make a world of difference....

Im pushing 230 hybrids at between 3140-3175fps depending on powder with my Norma Improved case on a 27.5” barrel and on 3rd reloads so far with no sign of losing primer pockets. Plus I’m under 3.72” COAL. It’s not a Nancy round that’s for certain... I’ve hit 3250 a couple times with still good extraction. Though I wouldn’t dare run it that hot.

Mike


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[wind gypsy]

At the end of the day what'd another 400fps buy you that your elevation turret couldn't?

You don’t make a bad point but I do like a little extra forgiveness on your wind and distance reads.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

The 300 Norma, and improved versions are excellent. When looking at the case design, especially the improved, it has the shortest powder column in its class. Shorter powder columns generally provide better ES and accuracy. The larger case head leaves more brass around the primer, that combined with Lapua making cases means this brass will handle serious pressure. While theres nothing wrong with a rum, the Norma design is superior in terms of accuracy potential.

 

[Ryan Avery]

The 300 Norma, and improved versions are excellent. When looking at the case design, especially the improved, it has the shortest powder column in its class. Shorter powder columns generally provide better ES and accuracy. The larger case head leaves more brass around the primer, that combined with Lapua making cases means this brass will handle serious pressure. While theres nothing wrong with a rum, the Norma design is superior in terms of accuracy potential.
View attachment 89894

With a good action, a quality barrel and chambering job, case design means very little between a 300 Norma and 300 RUM.

 

[mtmuley]

The "superior in terms of accuracy potential" was interesting. mtmuley

 

[Alex Wheeler]

We do have a very good understanding of what makes a cartridge accurate. Look to any successful long range Benchrest cartridge and you will see a lot of similarities. 6br, 6BRA, 6 dasher, 300 wsm, 6.5x47, ext. They are the shortest cases that achieve the goal. You will never see us go longer, if wider is a practical option.

 

[Ryan Avery]

Alex,
I am always trying to learn so I am not being a smart ass with these questions.

I take it you build rifles? So say you build 5 Rums and 5 300 Normas. Are you saying its easier to develop a load for the Norma or you can just throw any old load in them and it will shoot? Have you ever ran into issues with ES on these bigger fatter cases and lower powder volumes? Obviously there has to be a point of diminishing returns or we would see people using short 408 CT cases necked down.

 

[gbflyer]

Alex knows his stuff. He’s a welcome addition to any rifle accuracy discussion. Great to have a fellow with his experience aboard.

 

[bradb]

Alex is a well well well regarded smith, he knows his shit!

 

[HellsCanyon]

Alex,
I am always trying to learn so I am not being a smart ass with these questions.

I take it you build rifles? So say you build 5 Rums and 5 300 Normas. Are you saying its easier to develop a load for the Norma or you can just throw any old load in them and it will shoot? Have you ever ran into issues with ES on these bigger fatter cases and lower powder volumes? Obviously there has to be a point of diminishing returns or we would see people using short 408 CT cases necked down.

We also need to take into account body taper and case extraction for that point of diminishing returns. There’s definitely a point where “short/fat” cases stop yielding more consistency and practicality.

Mike


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[mtmuley]

While theres nothing wrong with a rum, the Norma design is superior in terms of accuracy potential.

The RUM is proven to be very accurate. Between the two, I'd say whatever jumps out at you. Hardly a wrong choice among big .30's. mtmuley

 

[Hiwayman92]

Just to stir the pot, I’ve finished load work on my Piercision Rifles 300 Norma Improved. 3209 fps with the 215 Berger. Here’s how it shot today at 484 yards. I’m not familiar with the RUM, but I don’t think they’ll do that kind of speed, will they?

.

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[Ryan Avery]

Just to stir the pot, I’ve finished load work on my Piercision Rifles 300 Norma Improved. 3209 fps with the 215 Berger. Here’s how it shot today at 484 yards. I’m not familiar with the RUM, but I don’t think they’ll do that kind of speed, will they?

.

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I am shooting a 300 RUM +P. No fireforming required at 3210 with a 230... Pot stirred... HAHA

 

[Elkhntr08]

No love for the 300 Weatherby?

 

[wind gypsy]

Just to stir the pot, I’ve finished load work on my Piercision Rifles 300 Norma Improved. 3209 fps with the 215 Berger. Here’s how it shot today at 484 yards. I’m not familiar with the RUM, but I don’t think they’ll do that kind of speed, will they?

Yeah, I'd expect a Norma improved to be about on par with a RUM velocity wise if throated similarly.