2 lost elk and conclusions.

Ucsdryder

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Jan 24, 2015
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Yep....100 % agreed.

But 9 times out of 10 a .270 isn't going to result in 2 holes....

Theres 2 things that matter.

To kill.

and to find the kill.

We lost 2 Elk in camp this year, both died within 150 yards, both shot in the lungs, maybe a little high, both little to no blood trail....Both with 130gr GMX bullets.

If your hunting in thick stuff you almost certainly will need a good blood trail ...at times.

If your rifle, scope fit you and are not ultra-lite theres no reason one cannot shoot a 300 win mag.????
I don’t have the energy to read 15 pages but curious if you lost 2 elk how you know they both died in 150 yards? And later on you said the other hunter with 40 years experience lost an elk that was a double lung. Did you find them later? Not trying to start an arguemejt or question you in any way other than curious how you ended up finding the outcome. Thanks!
 

BuzzH

WKR
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May 27, 2017
Messages
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Location
Wyoming
The few animals I've lost had 100% to do with a bad shot on my part and 0% to do with the rifle I was using at the time.

I reckon that to be the case with 95% of the "hunters" that blame their rifle, bullet etc. on their own bad shot placement.

I've fired 2 rounds at elk this year, one from a 6mm Rem. and a 90 grain accubond at 194 yards, slightly higher than mid-body tight behind the shoulder. Elk went maybe 10 steps and done. The other with a 7-08 and 140 grain accubond at 247 yards. Just above the heart, bull stiffened up, took a couple steps and done.

Got an exit on the bull at 247 with the 7-08, get exits 95% of the time.

Don't believe a 300 win mag would have made any difference.
 

MojoTX

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Jul 8, 2019
Messages
107
270 Win with 124 grain hammer bullet….. full pass through. 360 yard shot. Substantial blood trail.

Zoom in to first image to see more blood. Second image shows exit wound.


A71ACF3B-437B-4CC2-B468-6FE9F7265725.jpegFADA4591-095C-46FF-A169-F73B140276BA.jpeg
 

corey006

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Jun 19, 2019
Messages
162
Caliber of bullet really has very little to due with getting an exit. Bullet construction in most calibers has much more to do. Also in general on Elk seeing them get shot with about every common caliber and bullet make...exit holes are not the norm. If you are looking for blood trails hunting with a rifle is not a good method.

I don't care how thick it is...how do you lose an elk with in 150 yards let alone 2?
Where the Elk live in Sask the bush can be really thick. Most areas have been logged 2-3 times in past 120 years. The undergrowth is usually thick. Some of the "regen" after its been clear cut a bird would have a hard time flying through it.

Mix that in with creeks, beaver ponds, beaver runs.


Elk like to feed off clover innthe clear cuts, and in forest they feed off Hazel bush.

Sometimes Hazel bush can be so thick and high you cannot see 5ft into it. It can grow 12 feet high and so thick you have trouble walking through it...but Elk zip through it with ease.

Thats where they live....its not wide open pine forests , sparse aspen or alpine meadows like alot of USA states.

So yes.... lacking a blood trail you can lose any animal. Especially if it gets on an Elk path with a bunch of fresh tracks ....

I dont how much more you can get out of a .270 loaded with GMX bullets....they solid copper and made to penetrate?
 

corey006

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Jun 19, 2019
Messages
162
I don’t have the energy to read 15 pages but curious if you lost 2 elk how you know they both died in 150 yards? And later on you said the other hunter with 40 years experience lost an elk that was a double lung. Did you find them later? Not trying to start an arguemejt or question you in any way other than curious how you ended up finding the outcome. Thanks!
...because....he was hunting the area 3 days later and birds/scavengers led him to carcass....

The other one I found the same way...but the wind was blowing that and I actually smelt it as well...

I am not condoning what happened....

Rather than assuming he misses he should have flagged the area and did circle or grid pattern....but IF you dont find good blood it makes it all the much harder.

But both were on evening hunt, and shot was taken within 1/2 hour of dark.... so only 1/2 hour daylight to look, once it gets dark it makes things harder.


Sorry I guess some guys on here have NEVER lost an animal...?
 

scooter25

FNG
Joined
May 7, 2019
Messages
47
Location
Wyoming
It wasnt Me.

LOl.

I somewhat agree with what your saying.

BUT there isnt a hunter on this forum that hasnt made a bad shot, wounded an animal or lost an animal.

ANYONE that makes thst "claim" is 100% full of kaka.

IF you dont have a strong blood trail, and the Elk is on another trail with fresh tracks...

You can easily lose a blood trail.

They tend to die in thick stuff.

I shot my Elk this year in Archery and I followed the blood trail for 250 yards...in the rain.(towards the end). I was lucky to find him.

As far as the "guys" in my camp that lost the Elk.

One was a hunter with 40 years in the field.

The shot was double lung.

WHY he didn't find it? I wasn't there.

He thought he missed. He checked the spot where the Elk was standing and didn't find blood, or hair.

I do know he would have followed a blood trail IF there was one....he has the patience of Job.

The area we hunt has lots of water and they will cross it. Mix that in with a "Black" Elk path and no blood?

Getting back to the point I was trying to make.

A 270 will definitely work.

IS it the best choice?

Probably not... especially if the shot is high in the lungs....as the chest cavity will hold most of the blood in.

I would suggest a 300 mag with a Barnes , E-Tip, A-Frame or Partition.

A bullet/cartridge combo that if shot into the ribs has at least a chance making an exit hole....which makes for a better blood trail.
How can your friend claim a double lung shot if he thought he missed and didn't find any blood? In my experience the most important thing to clean kills is being proficient and confidant in your setup. Being able to spot your shot is key to me. You need to be able to know weather you hit or missed. Then being able to get back on target for follow up shot fast. You also need to be able to get setup in a comfortable shooting position. To me having your rifle setup so you can spot the shot and the gear to quickly get in a comfortable shooting position is far more important than the size of the bullet. I know that inside 400yds if I get set up in a steady position it won't matter if I'm shooting my 25-06 or my 300WSM I am confidant I can hit where I am aiming and will be able to make a fast follow up shot if needed.
 

Ucsdryder

WKR
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
6,691
...because....he was hunting the area 3 days later and birds/scavengers led him to carcass....

The other one I found the same way...but the wind was blowing that and I actually smelt it as well...

I am not condoning what happened....

Rather than assuming he misses he should have flagged the area and did circle or grid pattern....but IF you dont find good blood it makes it all the much harder.

But both were on evening hunt, and shot was taken within 1/2 hour of dark.... so only 1/2 hour daylight to look, once it gets dark it makes things harder.


Sorry I guess some guys on here have NEVER lost an animal...?
Dang, that’s rough. I found a dead bull last year that smelled pretty bad. The smell led me right to it!

I’ve lost one animal. I am confident it survived. Brisket hit, 4” of penetration, found the snapped arrow. I followed that elk over a mile per onx tracking and was on my hands and knees for a portion of it. The blood finally stopped completely. Never saw more than a drop every 10 yards then at the end found a drop every 50-100. He was heading up hill and never stopped. I came back the next day and looked for another 4 hours grid searching and never came up with anything more.

it’s sad someone would give up because it was getting dark and they only had 30 minutes.
 

corey006

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Jun 19, 2019
Messages
162
One thing about the intermet....theres no shortage of guys that are perfect hunters....

NEVER wounded, or lost an animal ever....1 shot kills all the time
Dang, that’s rough. I found a dead bull last year that smelled pretty bad. The smell led me right to it!

I’ve lost one animal. I am confident it survived. Brisket hit, 4” of penetration, found the snapped arrow. I followed that elk over a mile per onx tracking and was on my hands and knees for a portion of it. The blood finally stopped completely. Never saw more than a drop every 10 yards then at the end found a drop every 50-100. He was heading up hill and never stopped. I came back the next day and looked for another 4 hours grid searching and never came up with anything more.

it’s sad someone would give up because it was getting dark and they only had 30 minutes.
I am DONE splaining....

Every situation is different....

It wasnt me....

Its funny how 1 comment..

"270 is a womens gun"...which was kinda ment as a joke....got so many riled up?

So many on the defensive?

WHY?
 

Ucsdryder

WKR
Joined
Jan 24, 2015
Messages
6,691
One thing about the intermet....theres no shortage of guys that are perfect hunters....

NEVER wounded, or lost an animal ever....1 shot kills all the time

I am DONE splaining....

Every situation is different....

It wasnt me....

Its funny how 1 comment..

"270 is a womens gun"...which was kinda ment as a joke....got so many riled up?

So many on the defensive?

WHY?
Not sure why you’re directing it at me. Never said you didn’t anything wrong and told a story about how I lost an animal. The guys you hunt with probably should take up golf instead but none of what I said was directed toward you.
 

sndmn11

"DADDY"
Joined
Mar 28, 2017
Messages
10,487
Location
Morrison, Colorado
One thing about the intermet....theres no shortage of guys that are perfect hunters....

NEVER wounded, or lost an animal ever....1 shot kills all the time

I am DONE splaining....

Every situation is different....

It wasnt me....

Its funny how 1 comment..

"270 is a womens gun"...which was kinda ment as a joke....got so many riled up?

So many on the defensive?

WHY?

I was asking a genuine question to learn from the wealth of your experience. Why a double lung with a broadhead is preferable to a double lung with a .270? Unfortunately, it seems like you are apt to act defensive rather than enlighten so many of the inexperienced.
 

WCB

WKR
Joined
Jun 12, 2019
Messages
3,640
Where the Elk live in Sask the bush can be really thick. Most areas have been logged 2-3 times in past 120 years. The undergrowth is usually thick. Some of the "regen" after its been clear cut a bird would have a hard time flying through it.

Mix that in with creeks, beaver ponds, beaver runs.


Elk like to feed off clover innthe clear cuts, and in forest they feed off Hazel bush.

Sometimes Hazel bush can be so thick and high you cannot see 5ft into it. It can grow 12 feet high and so thick you have trouble walking through it...but Elk zip through it with ease.

Thats where they live....its not wide open pine forests , sparse aspen or alpine meadows like alot of USA states.

So yes.... lacking a blood trail you can lose any animal. Especially if it gets on an Elk path with a bunch of fresh tracks ....

I dont how much more you can get out of a .270 loaded with GMX bullets....they solid copper and made to penetrate?
I have hunting in thick stuff like you speak of... I know what it consists of in Alberta and also in parts of the U.S. Amazingly to we have Beavers here
 

CoStick

WKR
Joined
May 18, 2021
Messages
1,364
One thing about the intermet....theres no shortage of guys that are perfect hunters....

NEVER wounded, or lost an animal ever....1 shot kills all the time

I am DONE splaining....

Every situation is different....

It wasnt me....

Its funny how 1 comment..

"270 is a womens gun"...which was kinda ment as a joke....got so many riled up?

So many on the defensive?

WHY?
You trolled, people bit. Internet life.
 

Sled

WKR
Joined
Jun 11, 2018
Messages
2,265
Location
Utah
I apologize for ruffling the tail feathers of the .270 fanboys....

Didn't ruffle feathers. Just correcting inaccurate information. Any big game caliber paired with the correct projectile (for the task) will kill elk. The caveat is that the shooter needs to know the equipment and be willing to wait for the right shot. Carrying a bigger stick doesn't make the Indian any smarter.
 
Joined
Oct 16, 2021
Messages
46
Ought to get ur friends on here OP. Now that would be comical. Man you took some heat over that one didn't ya. Dang bro. They say . If you can't stand the heat stay out of the kitchen. I see you are still in the kitchen. So either you love the heat or are super hungry still . All jokes fyi.
 

204guy

WKR
Joined
Mar 4, 2013
Messages
1,292
Location
WY
One thing about the intermet....theres no shortage of guys that are perfect hunters....

NEVER wounded, or lost an animal ever....1 shot kills all the time

I am DONE splaining....

Every situation is different....

It wasnt me....

Its funny how 1 comment..

"270 is a womens gun"...which was kinda ment as a joke....got so many riled up?

So many on the defensive?

WHY?
Guys are reacting because you're making ridiculous statements as indisputable fact. The incredible irony or your posts is had your friends been shooting a softer bullet, something that you'd likely consider only suitable for coyotes like a berger or eld. An argument could be made those elk would have made it less than 150yds, maybe considerably less.
 
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Stalker69

WKR
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Apr 12, 2019
Messages
1,801
...because....he was hunting the area 3 days later and birds/scavengers led him to carcass....

The other one I found the same way...but the wind was blowing that and I actually smelt it as well...

I am not condoning what happened....

Rather than assuming he misses he should have flagged the area and did circle or grid pattern....but IF you dont find good blood it makes it all the much harder.

But both were on evening hunt, and shot was taken within 1/2 hour of dark.... so only 1/2 hour daylight to look, once it gets dark it makes things harder.


Sorry I guess some guys on here have NEVER lost an animal...?
I am sure we have all lost animals, any one that’s hunted long enough has. But many don’t blame the gun, we blame ourselves. A 270 will kill any elk with a properly placed shot. It’s the shooter that put the bullet in the improper spot, or possibly choose the wrong projectile for the job. And your getting ragged on for blaming the gun, it’s that simple. I shot a good size mule deer buck with a 243. My buddy calls it my BB gun. At the shot he dropped, but when we approached he jumped and took off. Never seen him again. I have killed a lot of antelope, deer and elk with that rifle, without issue. I feel I may have hit him in an antler, and knocked him out. But I know for sure it was not the gun, nor the 100 gr. Partition bullet that lost that deer for me, it was me.
 
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Marble

WKR
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May 29, 2019
Messages
3,580
I am sure we have all lost animals, any one that’s hunted long enough has. But many don’t blame the gun, we blame ourselves. A 270 will kill any elk with a properly placed shot. It’s the shooter that put the bullet in the improper spot, or possibly choose the wrong projectile for the job. And your getting ragged on for blaming the gun, it’s that simple. I shot a good size mule deer buck with a 243. My buddy calls it my BB gun. At the shot he dropped, but when we approached he jumped and took off. Never seen him again. I have killed a lot of antelope, deer and elk with that rifle, without issue. I feel I may have hit him in an antler, and knocked him out. But I know for sure it was not the gun, nor the 100 gr. Partition bullet that lost that deer for me, it was me.
I've seen that happen a few times. Both the antler and a hit to the body. How it was explained to me is the hydrostatic shock to the body (usually central nervous system related) temporarily incapacitates the animal. We have all probably hit some part of our body at some point where we cannot use that body part for a few minutes. I imagine it is something similar. Nerves recover and they are able to get up and move off. The antler strike just makes them woozey and they are fine later. But the other usually leads to death I would imagine.

I've hit deer near the spine and they lay there kicking a sprawling about for a few minutes like death kicks, only to have them get up and try to move off. Mortally wounded yes, but they could manage on their feet for a bit before they would die. Some have moved off several hundred yards and a track job had to happen.

The larger the impact, the larger the shock. Thats one of the reasons I advocate for the magnum guns on Elk.

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk
 

corey006

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Jun 19, 2019
Messages
162
I am sure we have all lost animals, any one that’s hunted long enough has. But many don’t blame the gun, we blame ourselves. A 270 will kill any elk with a properly placed shot. It’s the shooter that put the bullet in the improper spot, or possibly choose the wrong projectile for the job. And your getting ragged on for blaming the gun, it’s that simple. I shot a good size mule deer buck with a 243. My buddy calls it my BB gun. At the shot he dropped, but when we approached he jumped and took off. Never seen him again. I have killed a lot of antelope, deer and elk with that rifle, without issue. I feel I may have hit him in an antler, and knocked him out. But I know for sure it was not the gun, nor the 100 gr. Partition bullet that lost that deer for me, it was me.
I never once said the 270 would not work?

please quote me where I said that?

I said that a 300 win mag class cartridge has a better chance at making an exit hole....and therefore a better chance at a blood trail....and it DOES?

Is there anyone that questions that?

I wasnt the original poster in this thread?

The 2 Elk from our camp were killed dead to rights with a 270....but according to the hunters, one with 40 years hunting experience, and he has killed probably 25 Elk and 25 Moose there was no blood trail.

The one I found was double lung, but high. So chest cavity was holding most of the blood in.

Would a 300 win mag made a difference?

I think yes? it would have had an exit and therefore 2x holes to leave a blood trail.

Not everyone is a blood hound or can track an animal through dense forest without a blood trail?

As I also pointed out we dont hunt open meadows, sparse pine or aspen forests.

Its forests that have regen after being logged , sometimes 2-3 x....so the bush is like a jungle. So we hunt game trails and old grown in logging roads.

The reason why so many got offended was I called the mighty 270 a womens gun...lol....
 

corey006

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Jun 19, 2019
Messages
162
This year because I didn't draw any limited entry elk tags (love hunting rut crazed big bulls) I was helping an outfitter friend with his hunters. The first evening we had a hunter who was new to elk hunting in an area we had seen elk that morning. As we watched a sage clearing I continued quietly coaching the hunter that elk live in the bottom third of their body and try to place bullet close behind the front leg. About an hour before sundown a good bull stepped out closer than we were expecting at 160yds. The hunter was shooting off of sticks and had taken time to get comfortable. The hunter asked us if this was a good bull and we said to shoot when we stop it. I cow called and the bull locked up quartering slightly toward us.
At the shot the bull started moving to our left stumbling. After it went about 30 yds I stopped it with a cow call, the hunter shot again missing high left. The elk then turned back and was hit with the 3rd shot which sounded like a gut shot and the fourth shot was a miss. He then made it back into the quakies and the thick brush. I started having a crappy feeling and after 2 days we gave up the search. The hunter was using a .270 with 140 grain mono bullets.
The second troubling experience happened to an experienced hunter in camp who is also a great guide. After 17 years he drew a great tag and spent the summer patterning an incredible bull. On day 5 the bull finally presented a shot at a bit over 400 yds. At the shot the bull fell, got up, fell, got up into the brush and you guessed it was never seen again. My friend passed on numerous other bulls to concentrate on finding the wounded bull. At seasons end all he had was tag soup. The rifle he used was a .270. The guy handloads and is a good shot.
These 2 experiences caused me to reflect on my years of shooting elk and what conclusions I could draw to prevent problems again. Understand these are personal opinions I plan to follow and I realize many people will have different opinions, not looking for an argument. First- I will be adamant to hunters about where to hit elk, bottom third behind front leg on a broadside. Second- I will personally hunt with nothing smaller than my 7mm magnum with 160 grain or heavier lead bullets. After this year I may try 175 gr Nosler partitions. Third- I will limit my self to no shot longer than 400 yds and then only if I can shoot prone over a pack. The best bull I have ever shot at was facing me at 220 yds. I was sitting but wasn't using a rest. He fell at the shot and when I had worked my way over to him through the brush he was gone. My rifle was a 270 with a mono copper bullet. I am the one that pulled the trigger and the lost bull was my fault. It had taken 12 yrs to draw that tag.
This post is a little long but I hope it might help some new hunters. I realize other hunters have different ideas, do what's right for you.
This is the original post..

.270

loses 2 more....
 
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