1911’s in general, 9mm versions specifically

[43.6N]

I made the mistake of checking out the fancy pistol case at my LGS. Fondled a Stac XC, P, HD P4, DWX, DWX Compact, Valor, CZ TS2, Kimber DS Warrior, maybe one or two others.

First off, I don't know what black magic Staccato is using, but the XC is hands down the best feeling pistol I've ever held. Action, sights, trigger, controls, all perfect and incredibly intuitive. The first time I pointed it my sights were perfectly aligned, and picking it up a few times the grip was incredibly consistent. There are enough reference points that you just know right away your hand is in the right place.

The DWX was a close second. But overall that pistol feels much less practical than the XC. Heavier, longer, and with gaudy red anodized grips and mag bases it felt like explicitly a range toy.

I was surprised that I did not love the single stack "classic" 1911s as much. The grip felt longer front to back, and I could feel all the transitions from metal to grip panel to metal, and the grip safety. It was quite a bit more noticeable than the XC, and the long, narrow, round grip felt hard to index properly, like I didn't know that I had gripped it in the right place with as much certainty.

Triggers were all good to excellent, but the Stac HD and TS2 were noticeably not as good as some of the others.

Now I'm really torn, because the price point of the XC is ridiculous, but I also don't want to spend 2k and be underwhelmed.

Sounds like you need to get an XC.

I’d rather have one gun that I feel is an extension of my arm, than a whole arsenal that I don’t love.
I say sell anything you haven’t touched in the last 6 months, and be at peace buying the xc.

 

[NSI]

I made the mistake of checking out the fancy pistol case at my LGS. Fondled a Stac XC, P, HD P4, DWX, DWX Compact, Valor, CZ TS2, Kimber DS Warrior, maybe one or two others.

First off, I don't know what black magic Staccato is using, but the XC is hands down the best feeling pistol I've ever held. Action, sights, trigger, controls, all perfect and incredibly intuitive. The first time I pointed it my sights were perfectly aligned, and picking it up a few times the grip was incredibly consistent. There are enough reference points that you just know right away your hand is in the right place.

The DWX was a close second. But overall that pistol feels much less practical than the XC. Heavier, longer, and with gaudy red anodized grips and mag bases it felt like explicitly a range toy.

I was surprised that I did not love the single stack "classic" 1911s as much. The grip felt longer front to back, and I could feel all the transitions from metal to grip panel to metal, and the grip safety. It was quite a bit more noticeable than the XC, and the long, narrow, round grip felt hard to index properly, like I didn't know that I had gripped it in the right place with as much certainty.

Triggers were all good to excellent, but the Stac HD and TS2 were noticeably not as good as some of the others.

Now I'm really torn, because the price point of the XC is ridiculous, but I also don't want to spend 2k and be underwhelmed.

If you end up regretting the XC you will be able to move it along expeditiously. Treat yourself.

Agree that the 80 series HD triggers are quite underwhelming. If you don’t like the TS2 trigger you won’t like a roll trigger. But you may end up shooting it better than a glass rod in reality.

-J

 

[solarshooter]

Sounds like you need to get an XC.

I’d rather have one gun that I feel is an extension of my arm, than a whole arsenal that I don’t love.
I say sell anything you haven’t touched in the last 6 months, and be at peace buying the xc.

This is the type of peer pressure and enabling that I come to this forum for. Unfortunately I could probably sell every pistol I own and still wouldn't get there!

Before I can go all in, I need to shoot some of these back to back. Copping a feel is fun but you can't really know till you take em for a spin.

 

[Formidilosus]

With that being said, would you suggest people get a a 'foah-five' in a similar way to your encouragement of the three-o-hate? Or just skip to the 9mm? And why?

Oh no. 9mm. There’s no real reason other than nostalgia for the 45.

 

[CaptArab]

@solarshooter I'll be your detractor (read in Dave Ramsey voice)- the XC is about as useful as a fancy watch. Great for impressing your poor friends but not much else.

It's a brick in the waste band so you won't likely carry it and the comp makes it less reliable- they're sprung super weak because the reciprocating slide must fight the heavy comped barrel and downward gasses.

If you want a 40k round no cleaning stacatto like form demos, it's not an XC.

Additionally it has no home in USPSA - the comp puts you into open gun category and open gunners want something different entirely.

Plus comps are obnoxious on a field pistol you might shoot without ear pro (JMO).

If you want one for a fun range toy, snag it, but go used so you don't pay that initial depreciation hit.

A P (or C24 hint hint) and a case or two of ammo is a way better play.

 

[JohnJohnson]

I found this video to be an odd data point when it comes to Staccato but I guess anyone can have a lemon. Ben Stoeger had a Staccato lemon as well recently but they took care of him. At least they have an awesome warranty it seems.

 

[RockAndSage]

Additionally it has no home in USPSA - the comp puts you into open gun category and open gunners want something different entirely.

What category would a C24 with an optic and light fall into?

Is there a season with USPSA, that you have to start in the beginning or anything like that?

 

[cubdriver84d]

What category would a C24 with an optic and light fall into?

Is there a season with USPSA, that you have to start in the beginning or anything like that?

Limited optics.

 

[Dobermann]

Is there a season with USPSA, that you have to start in the beginning or anything like that?

Not in IPSC where I'm at ... just join the local club and start shooting matches. Might be different stateside, but I can't see a good reason for it.

 

[CaptArab]

What category would a C24 with an optic and light fall into?

Is there a season with USPSA, that you have to start in the beginning or anything like that?

Yeah limited optics. It's like carry optics but for SAO guns. If you're a bottom tier scrub like me that just wants to get better, you just register on PractiScore, show up and shoot. Most the guys are cool and they'll let you shoot anything in any squad so long as you're not a competitive threat trying to game it.

Carry optics = Glocks and shadow 2s
Limited optics = 2011s and sao CZs for the most part.

Those two divisions are about 70% of the action, then open, the everything else.

I don't know how the upper tier guys that travel around do things if they have to qualify or what. My range rotates a different pistol leagues match every weekend with IDPA uspsa steel challenge etc and I'm not loyal or competitive in any of them.

This is how the divisions break down for most local matches around me, and I think that's probably typical outside 10 round states.

RIP single stack.

Steel challenge is much more 1911 friendly, and generally more family focused and chill, but my local group is solid in that regard for all the leagues.

 

[RockAndSage]

Yeah limited optics. It's like carry optics but for SAO guns. If you're a bottom tier scrub like me that just wants to get better, you just register on PractiScore, show up and shoot. Most the guys are cool and they'll let you shoot anything in any squad so long as you're not a competitive threat trying to game it.

Carry optics = Glocks and shadow 2s
Limited optics = 2011s and sao CZs for the most part.

Those two divisions are about 70% of the action, then open, the everything else.

I don't know how the upper tier guys that travel around do things if they have to qualify or what. My range rotates a different pistol leagues match every weekend with IDPA uspsa steel challenge etc and I'm not loyal or competitive in any of them.

This is how the divisions break down for most local matches around me, and I think that's probably typical outside 10 round states.

RIP single stack.

Steel challenge is much more 1911 friendly, and generally more family focused and chill, but my local group is solid in that regard for all the leagues.
View attachment 1068425

This was super helpful, thank you. Appreciate the detailed explanations.

 

[RockAndSage]

The first time I pointed it my sights were perfectly aligned, and picking it up a few times the grip was incredibly consistent.

This is a bigger issue and advantage than is commonly appreciated, especially if someone isn't super experienced with handgunning at a performance level - it can cut down on a lot of dry-fire time and ammo to get to a certain level, as it already indexes more naturally. But the more experience you get with different guns, and the higher you perform with them, the less it matters. You learn to build an index a lot quicker with different guns, and don't need much time to adjust.

The DWX was a close second. But overall that pistol feels much less practical than the XC. Heavier, longer, and with gaudy red anodized grips and mag bases it felt like explicitly a range toy.

My DWX Compact indexed naturally for me, at a crazy level - it just fit like a glove. The full sized DWX though, it felt a lot longer and chonkier than necessary. Had a similar impression as you, in it being more of a range toy, or possibly a nightstand gun.

Triggers were all good to excellent, but the Stac HD and TS2 were noticeably not as good as some of the others.

Same for me on the TS2s, and other CZ guns. Everyone always talks about how great their triggers are, but compared to 1911s or 2011s, I have no idea what they're talking about. The SA triggers on any of them I've experienced were like the white kidnapper van of triggers - just a long rolling creep.

Strangely though, the trigger on my C24 is closer to that, with a longer creep to it on the sear travel, than the HDs I've felt have been. But I've heard a few times now that Staccato triggers can have a broader range of consistency than others, so I'm not sure what to think.

Now I'm really torn, because the price point of the XC is ridiculous, but I also don't want to spend 2k and be underwhelmed.

@CaptArab brought up some really solid points of consideration, especially with the USPSA stuff I'd had no idea about. I've run a lot of carry-comped guns though, and the trick with them is generally hotter ammo and really good lubrication. But the loudness (esp indoors), being more finicky, and a more limited utility on a big full-sized gun are a real thing. That said, as long as it's reliable, I wouldn't have a problem carrying OWB, or IWB if the holster, body-type, and clothing worked well for it.