150gr point vs 175gr - arrow spine & draw weight

[BrianSmart]

Been really playing around with Archers Advantage again. Have my first legitimate elk hunt planned (fingers crossed) in (duh) Sept.

Last year was shooting 65 pounds. Now am trying 70 pounds. Am committed to the Iron Will system. Really liked it for last year and my s100 zipped right through a small muley. I'm thinking that it might be best to go with s125 for Sept just to have that extra. What I'm finding is that I'm going to have to have two different arrow lengths (if I want to have the s100's for "deer") between the 150 and 175 gr point weight.

I've run Rampage, Axis and RIP TKO through the system and varying draw weight and point weight. No matter what, I need two different arrows lengths to get 'optimum spine' whether it's 350 or 200 spine.

So....before I commit to s125 heads, so I really NEED that extra 25 for elk? The Axis comes in as the 'best' for speed/weight/foc, but it's really splitting gnats hairs...

I'd just rather not have two different arrow lengths. I know regardless of 150 point weight or 175 it all depends on where the shot is placed. Hope this all makes sense!

Thanks!

 

[Jimbob]

Choose one arrow set-up and use that for muley and elk, no reason to switch. If you are switching arrows then your sight will change and even the tune of your bow might change.

Choose the specs you want your finished arrow at, build the arrow, shoot and tune then hunt everything with that arrow.

 

[nphunter]

No 25gr will not make any difference at all.

 

[Billy Goat]

Pick one, an elk arrow will kill a muley just fine, and vice versa.

 

[Zac]

None of this made sense to me.

 

[Felix40]

None of this made sense to me.

Same here

 

[Roughwater]

I kinda get where your going I think. If you are saying you have a 350 spine arrow and go to a slightly heavier draw weight from 65-70lb and a slightly heavier arrow point by 25gn, will you need to get a heavier spined arrow? Is that what you are asking? If so you may have to go to a 300 spine arrow but I would try your original arrow first and see if it will tune OK. Another option would be to cut your arrow by an inch or so if you can. That would make it stiffer allowing you to pull a little more weight or add a few more grains.

 

[Billy Goat]

I kinda get where your going I think. If you are saying you have a 350 spine arrow and go to a slightly heavier draw weight from 65-70lb and a slightly heavier arrow point by 25gn, will you need to get a heavier spined arrow? Is that what you are asking? If so you may have to go to a 300 spine arrow but I would try your original arrow first and see if it will tune OK. Another option would be to cut your arrow by an inch or so if you can. That would make it stiffer allowing you to pull a little more weight or add a few more grains.

He is already seeing that he needs to modify the arrow lengths, according to the program. He is questioning if it's worth dealing with two different length arrows to be able to shoot two different heads depending on species.

Could probably just run the shorter arrow with both heads and be fine, but I'd still just pick one and run with it. Not going to matter.

 

[5MilesBack]

Step away from the program and do some testing. I can put a 100gr head on any of my arrows and there is very little change between those and the arrows with 125's. And I have some 200's, 250's, 300's, and 340's.

 

[BrianSmart]

None of this made sense to me.

Does this help? If not no worries!

 

[Zac]

Yeah I think you were talking about point weight and it looked like you were referring to a 150-175 spine.

 

[BrianSmart]

Yeah I think you were talking about point weight and it looked like you were referring to a 150-175 spine.

Ooohhhh.....gotcha!!

 

[Roughwater]

Does this help? If not no worries!

I think my interpretation may have turned out to be pretty close to right which surprises me but I was just guessing he was talking point weight and not spine as I never heard of those kind of spine weights. I shoot some Victory RIP TKO arrows also in the same spine weight (350) and I'm creeping my bow's # weight up little by little toward 65# and concerned myself if my original spine weight of 350 might turn out to be too weak. Especially with my set of Xtorsion arrows that have the Ethics 155 gn outsert set up and 125 gn points and same spine weight. My total arrow weight on those arrows is 664 gn. But in the end I'm just going to take the advice I gave the OP and when I'm at my peak weight I'll retune my bow and if it works great super if not I can probably take up to 2" off my arrows or drop my front end weight a bit and retry tuning or both. But I do tend to like heavy arrows with a heavy FOC.
A online friend calls them armor piercing arrows, Ha. They don't fly fast but they fly quiet and hit hard. My Rip TKO's have the Ethics 125 gn spinning inserts and 125 gn points and only weigh in at 533 gn. I'm shooting a PSE Evoke SE 35" bow presently set at 62#. When I bought the bow 3 or 4 months ago I could only pull it set at 50#
and I didn't anticipate that I would ever work up to more than 60# so 350 spine seemed about the right spine weight but now I'm thinking I might actually end up peaking out the bow's max weight or near it which is 65# though I imagine it would peak slightly higher than that. So if it turns out I need to buy heavier spine arrows that's what I'll do if that's what it takes to make it tune.

 

[BrianSmart]

Yes - I edited the title - I was wanting to know how 'tight' the tolerances would be for dynamic spine and increasing the point weight by 25gr.

As ususal I'm over thinking, and under spelling, but I really like all the great information this site/people provide!

Thank you all!

 

[Marble]

As said above, choose one set up. Tune it well and go killing.

The programs that predicts spine and such will get you very very close. But there are variables.

If it were me, for your set up, I would choose 300 spine, put a 75 grain hit insert up front, 100 grain head (or 125 if you want). 4 max stealth vanes, 5inch wrap. Be right around 500 grains TAW.

Other vanes would be just fine too.

 

[Stalker69]

I shoot 175 gr heads also, but there are not many to choose from, and I don’t shoot those broad heads at every animal ( German kenitics, $$$) So what I do, is shoot 125 gr. Heads and add fact weights to the back of my inserts to get the weight to 175 gr. ( so I add a 50gr. Weight to the back of my insert when shooting 125 gr heads. And all I have to do is remove them ( super easy to do) when I shoot the 175gr. heads. No need for different arrows. If you do like some of the above posts suggest, heavier inserts they are pretty much permanent ( glued in) and a pain in the ass to deal with if you decide change your mind latter or just want to try something different, or they don’t tune right. The removable weights are super easy to add and remove its ridicules, and you can fine tune your arrow many times using them. Even at 175 gr. You might find 5 gr. more helps tune, just screw on a 5 gr. Weight. ( or 10 gr. ) or what ever it takes, it’s fun to mess with foc, and chrono check what your arrow is doing. And you can go back and forth, so easily.