Wyoming special draw increase ...

[ScottR_EHJ]

I've seen in other threads members reference the decline of Mule deer to being out competed by elk.

This can be verified with the Type 6 tags that were used for many years in the elk areas in Region G/H. Those tag numbers have dropped some, but it was an intentional effort to reduce a population that was competing with mule deer in every part of their range.

 

[Laramie]

Genuinely curious; how does WY have too many elk? Not enough landscape to hold/feed them?

There are several areas that are way over objective. The elk reside primarily on private land so it is challenging to harvest enough elk. Many of the landowners in these areas do allow hunting in one way or the other but the ones that don't end up like sanctuaries during the hunting seasons.

 

[Fitzwho]

Dang, I thought what I paid for a special antelope tag this year was high. Guess I'll be applying regular every year and hoping for a random tag.

Never going to use the special draw for a general elk tag that is OTC for residents and only costs them $57. Plus likely never going to have enough points for a limited entry elk hunt, so definitely looks a bit excessive on the elk side of things, but even if it does pass it won't affect me necessarily. Does look like price gouging to say the least or catering to the "wealthy hunter". Could I swing the price tag, yes. Just wouldn't want to.

$1200 for a deer tag? Don't let Utah here about that, don't want them getting any ideas until after I draw my Henry Mountain tag... Actually I would pay that in a heartbeat for a Paunsaugunt or Henry's tag.

 

[Laramie]

We all know there is an all-out war on Non Resident elk hunters. Something is going to be done in every state to significantly reduce our numbers over the next few years.

In an idea world it would be by the luck of the draw not your financial situation.

I don't think that is the case at all. Resident populations are increasing causing more local demand. That creates internal pressure on agencies to appease local hunter populations. At the same time social media and the internet are creating higher and higher demand from non-residents. There really is no way for most agencies to make everyone happy. There simply isn't enough supply to meet the demand. Their only real solution is to do their best to offer residents the majority of the tags while maintaining populations at over objective levels so they can offer the maximum number of tags to non-residents.

As to your luck of the draw comment, I agree. I would be in support of making all tags random and equal in price.

 

[Lawnboi]

It’s all fun and games shitting on less fortunate until your the one priced out.

 

[Dos Perros]

As it stands, the special draw isn't working. For some areas, the odds of drawing in the special are actually lower than in the regular draw. 2k seems really steep to me but some change is needed to bring the draw odds back in line.

Then apply in the regular draw. Simple.

 

[LostArra]

$1200 for an antelope?
That is one special antelope

 

[Pacific_Fork]

I’d bet the house that all of you justifying this topic saying “just make more money, move, I’m a blue collar worker, I’ll always hunt elk, blah blah” have a breaking point. Let’s see the guy in a 15 year old Subaru working at the mill go elk hunt next year on a $25k tag. Won’t happen, point being everyone has a point in which they will no longer be able to hunt elk because of tag fees. Most of us aren’t there yet, but it’s possible. Slippery slope is real in that article.

There’s a reason 99% of members here aren’t hunting Sheep in Alaska and it ain’t because it’s during elk season….$$$$$$

 

[wapitibob]

The TRW Committee passed this special fee increase and it now goes to legislature.
The Task Force will entertain a price increase for the BIg 5 in Nov, they will also entertain a price increase for all nr licenses.

The Game Commission has not removed the nr 7250 Elk cap, that will come up in July 2023 along with nr Elk regions. If those pass, nr region quotas will be voted on in April 2024

 

[fatlander]

What private landowners did I mention? The quota in NR elk tags was removed, humm isn't that actually increasing NR opportunity?
We don't need expansion of elk at all, they are doing fine. Mule deer on the other hand are in desperate straights right now in parts if the state.
How would 85 million combat drought ? We're all ears on that please.

If 85 million couldn’t improve habitat, how is more money going to do it any better?

If the price increase in the special decreases demand therein, draw odds are now worse in the regular. This does nothing but ensure those with means hunt more often than those without, all the while siphoning more money off of the backs of sportsmen.

If they’re not putting more animals on the landscape, and therefore more tags in pockets, why do they need more money? They going to do a 10 million dollar rain dance? These are legitimate questions that get lost in the sauce when the these are “my tags” bull shit gets in the way.


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[BRTreedogs]

If 85 million couldn’t improve habitat, how is more money going to do it any better?

If the price increase in the special decreases demand therein, draw odds are now worse in the regular. This does nothing but ensure those with means hunt more often than those without, all the while siphoning more money off of the backs of sportsmen.

If they’re not putting more animals on the landscape, and therefore more tags in pockets, why do they need more money? They going to do a 10 million dollar rain dance? These are legitimate questions that get lost in the sauce when the these are “my tags” bull shit gets in the way.


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Fuel has doubled. Idk wtf govt does w any of my money. But I bet the fuel budget is huge.

 

[fatlander]

Fuel has doubled. Idk wtf govt does w any of my money. But I bet the fuel budget is huge.

Are they driving around for the rain dance? They’re still anticipating well over 12 million in surplus this year: https://www.wyomingnews.com/rawlins...cle_c2114ffb-8050-5f38-8679-86449b5537fe.html

So what are they going to do with all this extra money?

Did they do more in years when fuel was cheapest in decades (COVID) than they did in the years leading up to it?

Of course not. It’s government doing what government does. They never spend less, ever. Again, those are the questions we should be asking that require some actual thinking as opposed to blaming our fellow sportspeople for tags or lack there of.


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[Tod osier]

Looks like they read this thread where many were saying the cost didn't matter:

Non-resident elk hunters breaking point.

Non-resident elk hunters . I am curious at what threshold most non-residents would say I'm done and move on to other endeavors. Maybe you don't have a threshold . I think realisticly most do. I realize there are a million different scenarios .maybe you hunt elk in your home state. Vested...

www.rokslide.com

 

[Rambucsabillbul]

As a NR and looking into this draw , it's discouraging to say the least.
Your common folk are getting priced out of the market.
Hunting in the USA and Canada are quickly becoming for the Rich only
Stone Sheep hunts here in BC, $60,000 US funds.
The Roosevelt Bull Elk draw I have and just completed as a resident of BC resident sells for $35,000 US funds! Crazy!
I've been looking more and more to travel to the USA for hunts, but wow the pricing on many hunts, even Pheasant is getting Insane.

 

[bsnedeker]

As a NR and looking into this draw , it's discouraging to say the least.
Your common folk are getting priced out of the market.
Hunting in the USA and Canada are quickly becoming for the Rich only
Stone Sheep hunts here in BC, $60,000 US funds.
The Roosevelt Bull Elk draw I have and just completed as a resident of BC resident sells for $35,000 US funds! Crazy!
I've been looking more and more to travel to the USA for hunts, but wow the pricing on many hunts, even Pheasant is getting Insane.

If the current trend continues: Western big game hunting continues to get more popular + populations in western states continues to grow at the current rate; the reality is that NR hunting is going to be severly limited and/or reserved for only the very wealthy. General folks will be limited to only hunting their home states.

That's just reality and we are seeing it slowly come to pass. You can get mad at residents of western states if you want to, but we aren't the problem....these trends are the problem and the source of these trends is NOT western state residents, it's folks who don't live out here wanting to move and/or hunt here every year.

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[Laramie]

Then apply in the regular draw. Simple.

I'm assuming there was some sarcasm there... But just in case not- There is no way to predict the number of applicants going into either drawing. Historically the special draw had much better odds but in recent years there have been more people willing to spend extra cash to draw early so occasionally the special draws have actually ended up with worse odds.

I will state I would be much happier with no special draw and have everything in one pool. It is abundantly clear that isn't on the table and likely never will be. So, if they are going to keep the special draw, it makes sense, from the state's perspective, to try to recreate the separation that was originally intended.

 

[Dos Perros]

I'm assuming there was some sarcasm there... But just in case not- There is no way to predict the number of applicants going into either drawing. Historically the special draw had much better odds but in recent years there have been more people willing to spend extra cash to draw early so occasionally the special draws have actually ended up with worse odds.

I will state I would be much happier with no special draw and have everything in one pool. It is abundantly clear that isn't on the table and likely never will be. So, if they are going to keep the special draw, it makes sense, from the state's perspective, to try to recreate the separation that was originally intended.

What is the benefit of having draw odds differential between regular and special?

Edited to add: 0% sarcasm in my line of thinking and posting on this topic

 

[Trial153]

What is the benefit of having draw odds differential between regular and special?

Edited to add: 0% sarcasm in my line of thinking and posting on this topic

To add”value” to increased cost of the tag.

I am sure it was never proposed to lower the cost of the the regular tag… which would accomplish the same thing …alas there are still sheep to shear and greed will always win.

 

[Laramie]

What is the benefit of having draw odds differential between regular and special?

Edited to add: 0% sarcasm in my line of thinking and posting on this topic

To the average guy, a chance to draw sooner if he budgeted for it. Maybe the value of a hunt goes up in someone perspective due to life circumstances - ie guy gets cancer and wants one more hunt kind of thing.

That wasn't the reasoning it was created though - it was for the outfitters to provide their clients a way to draw more frequently or not have to wait so long once they were booked.

It isn't friendly to the average budget hunter in general and in most instances lowers the odds applicants in the regular have of drawing.

Ironically, the only time I have applied in the special I could have drawn in the regular. For whatever reason, applications dropped that year. I did draw though.

 

[wind gypsy]

What is the benefit of having draw odds differential between regular and special?

Edited to add: 0% sarcasm in my line of thinking and posting on this topic

Outfitters' well heeled clients can get tags quicker.

I don't see that as a benefit but it's the main reason I see for them doing this.