understanding the shoulder shot

JJHACK

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This question comes up many times in my lodge when hunters are trying to decide where to shoot African game. I think it's best to sort out a few terms, such as "shoulder". The shoulder is not a bone, it's a joint, it's also referred to as the muscular region around the scapula and humerus. I would bet the vast mojority of people don't fully understand this bit of anatomy. The scapula is also known as, or is often referred to as, the shoulder blade. The humerus is the first long bone of the front leg which is connected to the scapula. There is no single part of the anatomy that is a "shoulder", but rather the area of the joint which is called the shoulder.
img_kudu-shoulder.jpg


In this Kudu anatomy drawing, you can see the scapula isn't really covering anything vital. A small portion of the spine, which is a very small target to define, when under the skin and muscle. If the shot is too high, the bones can still be hit solid, but no vital organs will take a direct hit. A miss of the scapula, too low, is much better.
When you hear a person say they "broke the shoulder(s)", they typically refer to that (in my opinion) as the scapula or humerus bones. An absolutely dead on the money bullseye into the shoulder would be the joint between the two. However I challange anyone to show me that they've broken them both!
Shooting through the shoulders is simple enough but doesn't always mean any bones were broken, or any vital organs hit. I have a shoulder blade right here on my desk from a black bear that has a healed bullet hole right through it. It has another hole from my bullet which actually killed the bear.
img_kudu-shoulder1.jpg

This shows the relationship of the scapula and actual humerus bones. The lower humerus was from the other side of this bear, or opposite front leg. It was shot and broken and then healed just fine allowing this bear to keep on living, although he had a severe limp. The scapula also had a bullet hole on the top edge. My bullet hit lower and killed the bear many years after the original hunter wounded him, by taking the shoulder shot only inches too high.
If an animal has the shoulder joint between the scapula and humerus broken on both sides they cannot make forward progress with there front legs, that is plain and simple. If you shoot too high, through the shoulder blades, you will be below the spine and above the organs just as this scapula above shows. If you blow through the humerus you will, in nearly every case, hit vital organs and make quick death of the animal.
The vast majority of hunters I've heard say "I broke the shoulders" are referring to the front legs being broken. My question would be (if I was rude) lets skin him and see what's broken I want you to show me where the shoulder is. It would not likely be identifed properly by the majority of recreational sport hunters.
I like the low scapula shot and take it often. Anyone shooting this way must have a fair bit of anatomy knowledge. This whole assembly floats inside the body. The front scapula and leg bones are not linked to the rest of the skeleton with a joint. They are free floating and have no skeletal connection to the rest of the skeleton's bones. From the scapula down they are only connected to each other and not the rest of the skeleton. Again most hunters don't picture it this way and most assume there is some big joint connecting the front legs to the main skeleton similiar to the pelvis joint.
img_kudu-shoulder2.jpg

This is a closer photo of the off side broken humerus bone which had completely healed. It's 30% shorter than the other side, but this bear lived many years after being shot in the leg. My guess is that the bears leg was too far forward climbing up a hill and the bullet that broke this leg exited the armpit and missed the body completely.
Because of this when an animal walks climbs or stands up hill or down hill the joints in the front legs move a great distance. The scapula can move nearly a foot under the skin in every direction, it's loose under there and moves all around depending upon the stride or reach of the animal.
Making this your aimpoint causes various concerns depending upon the way the animal is standing. The bones on the right do not always match the bones on the left either. They are fully independent of one another. I like to "break the shoulders" but what exactly does that mean? To me it means break the humerus or the joint connecting the humerus to the scapula. Anything higher is non vital except for the very small section of spine (although likely pretty painful) and lower is below any reasonable reference to a shoulder shot. Even though lower can be a perfect heart shot and still very lethal. With some high powered rifles and explosive bullets, a shot through the scapula will destroy enough bone that the additional fragmnets will explode into the chest cavity causing additional hemorage of vital organs.
I think the most important thing to remember about the whole thing is not to deliberately shoot for the scapula but rather just below it or at the bottom of it. A shot going only a few inches high will be a complete distaster and the animal will run for a long way! Missing the mark on the lower side is going to be better every time.
Here is another angle of the scapula above showing the top edge of the bullet hole. Not much of a miss too high, but it was enough to allow him to survive for years. It has quite a lot of abnormal growth but the hole is still through it.
img_kudu-shoulder3.jpg


It's important, I think, to understand these concepts before you go out and start trying to bust shoulders!
 

Matt Cashell

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Interesting post, JJ, thanks.

Have you found the scapula drops further over the vitals when as the leg is positioned forward? In my experience, a bullet through the lower half of the scapula results in a dead critter. This is what I think of when I hear the "high shoulder" shot.
 

sab

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The front scapula and leg bones are not linked to the rest of the skeleton with a joint. They are free floating and have no skeletal connection to the rest of the skeleton's bones. From the scapula down they are only connected to each other and not the rest of the skeleton. Again most hunters don't picture it this way and most assume there is some big joint connecting the front legs to the main skeleton similiar to the pelvis joint.

If you think that most hunters don't know how the shoulder is put together, then you must only know hunters who've never quartered a quadriped. The first time I quartered a whitetail years ago, I learned this anatomy lesson, and I'm no rocket scientist...

Regards,
Scott
 
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I cut all my own animals, so I know the anatomy. But I hate cutting up shoulders where the humerus or scapula got shot...it's just messy. If I need to drop an animal in its tracks I'd be more inclined to shoot it in the neck.
 

ckleeves

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I would think that the first shot from the hunter who wounded the bear was above the spine. I haven't seen animals shot through the scapula below the spine live for very long.
 
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JJHACK

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I say this about the anatomy because there are so many hunters that describe the shot and the damage done. It's actually either hilarious or pitiful with the lack of knowledge.

Tell me you have never heard a fella say " if you break a shoulder they cannot run." What exactly are they breaking? Or "I shot him through both shoulders"

With the floating nature of the scapulas and the lower leg bones, what are the odds of this double shoulder breaking shot? the shoulders are muscles not bones! I can see puncturing or perforating, or even blasting them! However "breaking" is a reference to bones. I'm not trying to nit pick. It's just one of those credibility things that sets off a bit of caution when I'm listening to somebody talk about shot placement bullet or arrow performance and lethal shots.

There are bone breaking shots and heart lung shots, and even spine shots. When saying " shoulder shot" ....... well I need more then this 20" area of scapula range of motion to get an understanding about what exactly is being described. I guess, as was pointed out in another thread. Members here are mostly on the OCD side of the scale. Likely why I feel comfortable with the forums here. So when I hear this " shoulder" description, I usually expect a loud burp, spitting tobacco juice on the ground, and asking for another beer. It's just not the kind of thing a more scientific or analytical hunter would blurt out. It may just be more geographical for me. Others may not have experienced this?

I guess where this dilemma originated for me was with Elmer Keith. He wrote frequently of shoulder shots and perfect heart shots. In more then one reference in his books he wrote of game that was so tough that even with a perfectly made shoulder shot the animal still ran a mile and vanished because the bullet was no good. These writings were always amusing to me. If the animal escaped and was never found, how could there be any certainty to the shot placement or the bullet performance?

I certainly fall on the Elmer Keith side of the fence VS the Jack O'conner side. He was a great early gun hero for me. But often there was a bit of embellished or shall we say "artistic license" in the books!
 

Jon Boy

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I'm not trying to nit pick.

Actually, I think you are... When people refer to a shoulder shot, I always think of the front quarter. In my experience they are generally referring to tissue area that makes up the front quarter, but sometimes they hit the scapula too. It puts game down in a hurry, whether you hit the scapula or not, this is a very proven shot and I'm not exactly sure what your trying to prove with this post? When some one says shoulder shot it means just that, in the shoulder, or front quarter if you will.

You would rather people people say "I hit the scapula" or "I hit the tissue area of the front quarter that makes up the shoulder and the buck went right down" ?

I'm not trying to be rude, just trying to figure out your last post??

There are bone breaking shots and heart lung shots, and even spine shots. When saying " shoulder shot" ....... well I need more then this 20" area of scapula range of motion to get an understanding about what exactly is being described. I guess, as was pointed out in another thread. Members here are mostly on the OCD side of the scale. Likely why I feel comfortable with the forums here. So when I hear this " shoulder" description, I usually expect a loud burp, spitting tobacco juice on the ground, and asking for another beer. It's just not the kind of thing a more scientific or analytical hunter would blurt out. It may just be more geographical for me. Others may not have experienced this?
 

Matt Cashell

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I am with you there Jon Boy. Most people think of a "shoulder shot" has the general area they are aiming for.

When people say they broke the shoulder, I guess I just assume they meant they fractured the scapula or adjoining bones/joints.

Maybe I have been too lax in my thinking.

I don't chew tobacco, but I do drink beer.

I do like to think about the location of the scapula though, especially when bowhunting.
 

sab

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Tell me you have never heard a fella say " if you break a shoulder they cannot run." What exactly are they breaking?

I think you're being too sensitive. I've used that exact terminology. Keep in mind that the shoulder is a mechanical system. It is composed of rigid structures (bones) and linear actuators (muscles). Whether your shot destroys bone or muscle, the result is the same -the system is BROKEN; hence, we dumb hunters say, "I broke his shoulder" even when no bones may have been broken...

Regards,
Scott
 
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JJHACK

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There is definitely some geographical issues here. The same phrases and terms used in say coastal Alaska are different then when I hear somebody from southern Mississippi, Louisiana, even comparing the NE and say Texas

Combine that with having been raised in a house where self sufficiency down to the last detail was groomed into daily life. I suppose certain characteristics just begin to shine through. Having had to butcher and prepare meals from all sorts of species of fish and seafood, and poultry from quail to turkey. Then of course every mammal species through domestic livestock including having to can hundreds of jars of meat every year from my preteen years til I left home.

Then tending the vegetable garden and canning all that food too! Some of what you folks point out is spot on. My analytical OCD side is poking through in my writing as well!
 

joehunter8301

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I love this subject. I have been very intrigued by same thing but I agree with others as your being a little harsh in how your presenting this. I have studied, autopsied, and learned about how the shoulder works, where bones sit and what shot placement results in what. I am a bowhunter so anything I refer to is more archery related but I'll spill my thoughts an experiences per say.

Lots of guys say African animals have more forward vitals etc. I say this is sorta bs. Reason being have you ever seen the real anatomy of a NA animal? Deer? Antelope? Elk? They all are relatively similar. I think Africa guys just push the "shoot them forward" more an it's just what the perception is rather than reality. The shoulder bone structure is almost identical to that of the pic you posted of the kudu. Realistically the lungs on a standing broadside animal only go a few inches behind the crease, then you have liver too. It's been a standard in NA to aim "behind the shoulder" which is really wrong. 3d targets, light arrows and expandables all keep people scared of the shoulder muscle which in reality if you shoot an animal straight up the leg 1/3 of the way up it centers lungs and top of heart. Hitting the crease is back of lungs which usually is a kill but too many guy shoot 4-5" back and it results in either liver or guts at best. They just don't know, have never been taught the right thing, or just don't know cuz they watch too much tv and rage bs rather than learning for themselves. I was so fascinated I took it upon myself to learn this stuff.

There was a thread on bowsite a few years back, Myb some of you saw it done by a guy known as BB, talkin about shooting animals more forward and he couldn't be more right. The shoulder meat is not hard to get an arrow thru it's more so understanding the anatomy of it and adjusting. Since shifting my aiming more forward instead of behind the crease I have had more blood and shorter trails. I wish I could reach out and teach more ppl this instead of them going off 3d targets, it just irks me to see them taught wrong. Yes a gut/liver shot deer dies every time but many are lost because people simply don't know what they actually hit and bump the animal trailing. What they call a "perfect smoked em" shot really isn't perfect at all.

And on the subject of the scapula it's often times when shooting downhill or out of tree stand to put an arrow right thru it and the downward angle puts it right thru the lungs. Yes on flat ground broadside it's high but I shot a hog few months
Ago quartering to me downhill. Arrow blew thru the scapula double lunged him an he went 20 yards. So not all you claim is 100% cut an dry truth.

Also the quartering to shot is not a bad option if you study an know where the bone sits, it's a very doable shot with a heavier arrow setup or in your case a rifle. I could prob write an entire book on this but I think I've covered most of my thoughts. Feel free to let me know if you think I missed anything or where I might be wrong. Good huntin fellas.
 

SDHNTR

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I think this is all funny. Mental masterbation. We all know where to shoot animals. I'd rather be closer to the shoulder than further away from it.
 

jmez

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It's just semantics. How nit picky do you want to be? Should we really be saying muscle mass around the shoulder joint when all of those muscles have names?
 

5MilesBack

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Kind of funny, because the title of your thread implies a "region" to me, which is how I use the terminology of "shoulder" on an animal. Yet in your posts, you talk more of specific bones than a region. The only time I'm referring to a joint when I say shoulder, is on humans.
 
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We are taught as Bowhunters via targets and hunter ed to shoot for behind the shoulder to hit
Vitals. The truth is that shooting strait up the leg is the ticket. More room for error and if you hit your mark. Then you have a heart shot.

Wish they would teach this.
 

Broz

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If they are broadside where a "shoulder shot" is made available, I will ignore it a place a fragmenting jacketed bullet in the crease behind the "shoulder" every time. Vitals will be destroyed. I don't use solids anymore that have sailed through and left me a tracking job before. Been using this method for many years now with well over 100 elk down. The results prove theirself and we haven't tracked one since. Good post from the OP with lots of info that should be considered.
Thanks
Jeff
 

Rizzy

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I think I'll just start referring to it as the front quarter shot ;)

Most of us who backpack hunt have a working knowledge of the bone structure on the front and rear quarters because we bone out the meat in the field and pack it out.
However I wouldn't doubt that the majority of hunters as a whole don't know the bone configuration of the big game animals. A lot of game animals are drug to the truck whole or quartered out and taken to the butcher.
 
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JJHACK

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If there is a good takeaway from this, it's that the bones of the leg do not continue straight up to the scapula. That humerus bone angles straight forward away from the most vital shot placement area.

This is complicated in that the range of motion can change this positioning. It's why in the hunter education training for archery we try to impress upon the students that they wait for the facing front leg to take the step forward before the arrow is released. Never take the shot when that front leg is trailing to the rear.

Just be patient and wait on that next step.
 

Broz

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If there is a good takeaway from this, it's that the bones of the leg do not continue straight up to the scapula. That humerus bone angles straight forward away from the most vital shot placement area.

This is complicated in that the range of motion can change this positioning. It's why in the hunter education training for archery we try to impress upon the students that they wait for the facing front leg to take the step forward before the arrow is released. Never take the shot when that front leg is trailing to the rear.

Just be patient and wait on that next step.

Right on, and not only for archery. I shoot long and this opens up the widest area for error due to wind which is our biggest hurdle.

Jeff
 
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