The Risks We Take

FreeRange

WKR
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Aug 11, 2014
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N. ID
I've felt compelled to respond to a few different threads touching on this topic the past week and figured I'd just start a new post to open up a conversation regarding this. The contrasting outcomes between the thread Ron's wife put up regarding the pause in her husbands' SPOT check-in's and the thread regarding the goat hunter who died carrying out his billy make us all face questions about the risks we take and our pursuit of the experience. Both stories definitely made this real for me. I'm curious to hear where some of you stand and how you convey that to your families.

I've always ascribed to the mantra of "I'd be happy to die doing what I love" and took big risks in the mountains and in most other pursuits. But after getting married 4 years ago and even more so with the birth of my son last year, I've have to dial that back and it isn't a natural thing for me.

I carry a SPOT for my wife's peace of mind and also to give myself the best possible chance of coming home alive, I prepare for every contingency and am pretty prideful, it would take a lot for me to hit that "911" button, but I know there are situations you simply won't be able to get yourself out of while hunting solo, as I typically do. It hurts my pride to even carry the SPOT, but I know there are good reasons to bring it.

I had a friend go missing a few years back, our group of 5 had been scrambling up a remote river canyon and didn't make the progress we'd hoped, he was a more experienced climber than any of us and when our party decided to turn back, he opted to go on ahead. After hours of him not coming back, I went looking for him. I found his body at the bottom of a cliff, he'd fallen about 60 feet. From the looks of things a SPOT wouldn't have saved him. I still question all the time whether being there myself would have prevented that outcome.

The effect the experience had on me as an outdoorsman was profound, faced with the reality of the risks we take, it confirmed in me that they are pursuits worth following. If I didn't truly love this life then, I know the experience would have soured me to it and I would have given up all of this. More than before, I sought out exposure, risk and solitude and found it more fulfilling than ever.

It is an absolute tragedy that "TJ" did not return home to his children. But had he made it through, no doubt, that experience would have probably been at or near the very pinnacle of his hunting career. Reading about the climbers that found him, still alive, it cut to my core because I've been there. Going into this season I was faced with a very real reminder of some things I don't like to think about. But again it makes me accept and embrace what we're chasing when we strike out for the hills. And what we take down from the mountain with us are things we can get no other place.

My wife knew that when she married me, probably years before that, and she trusts me to make rational decisions when I'm out by myself, I have to respect that and it changes the way I operate. I still do things that every single person I know thinks are crazy. I'm sure most of you can relate. There's no definite line we can say, "as long as I don't step over that line, I'm perfectly safe, and I can still enjoy myself on this side" A lot of people out there do have that line, but as a group that chases wild animals in wild places, that line doesn't exist.

I envy the man I was who didn't have a SPOT, or a mortgage, or a plan, and had months to waste away in the wilderness. But I wouldn't trade where I am today for a bit of that. To be honest, at times I find myself resenting the responsibility that keeps me from taking things to the levels I want to, only at times, but to come home from the field with meat for my family and a calmed spirit, I know is a stronger counter to those feelings.

My wife still cries when I leave for a trip, my son doesn't understand why I leave, our friends don't understand the way I am, my bird dog I figure is the only one who gets it. Maybe some of you guys do too, we're a strange breed, I know.

Have a good season. Kiss your wife, hug your kids and go find what you're looking for.
 

Shrek

WKR
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Jul 17, 2012
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Hilliard Florida
With my son in college I'm free to take more risk these days and I certainly would rather die chasing my dreams than in a hospital bed after an agonizing decline for both me and my loved ones. None of my friends are even slightly interested in going to a mountain and hiking miles from a road to hunt . Friends all know I'm a little crazy. They are into food plots and 5th wheel campers. Besides , I have a dangerous job anyway so I'm numb to risk.
 

avodude

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Nov 7, 2013
Messages
138
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Moscow, ID
I'm curious to hear where some of you stand and how you convey that to your families.

What it comes right down to, to me, is that it is a spiritual thing being in the wild chasing wild things. I'm not religious, in fact I'm agnostic-leaning towards some force of nature something out there. Being in the wild is where I'm closest to understanding how things really are. I can relate to others, like Robby Denning, who are grateful to their creator for allowing them another day in the wild. I respect that because I see it in myself when I'm out there.

My wife understands that being an outdoorsman means a great deal to me even though she may not understand why I spend so much time and money to do so. She does miss me when I'm gone but that is better than dealing with the me that didn't go hunting. I have missed a few hunting seasons and have vowed never to do that again. I end up feeling empty, like there is some sort of loss - I missed out.

When fellow hunters/friends end up dying in the wild, it is a reminder to me that there are consequences to crossing that line. Sometimes a chain of small events can lead to crossing that line. With TJ, it was a tragedy because he waited 12 years to get that goat, he did his research, he was successful and then he died getting it off of the mountain. His death affects me much more than reading an obituary in the paper about someone who died in a car - something that we ignore, basically, but that happens much more often. Does his death keep me from going out there? No, but I will be careful. If the wild was safe and easy to get to, everyone would go there. It wouldn't be the wild anymore and it wouldn't mean what it means to me.
 

FLAK

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Flying from Florida to Idaho next month for Elk. DIY, Solo backpack.
But I will have a sat phone.
Either that, or sit home wishing I was.
 
Joined
Oct 15, 2013
Messages
414
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The Bluegrass State
Death awaits us all. I do think that there are lines you should not cross. Since hearing the news, I've thought a lot about what might have happened to TJ. Did he try to make a gap he shouldn't have with 100lbs on his back? We may never know, but it hurts me to think about. It's a thin line we walk. I can't live in a world where I insulate myself from the dangers of nature, but I want to see me son and unborn daughter grow up. Remember, you are much more likely to die on the drive there. Just be careful out there, brothers and sisters.
 
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Messages
4,623
Location
Colorado
If I had the choice I would die out in the woods or die fire fighting. Watching my dad die from cancer was painful for me. But the woods are the safest place in this day in age I think. One of our biggest dangers is driving to and from work, hunting etc. The roads are scary.
 

jmez

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Jun 12, 2012
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Piedmont, SD
Respect nature and her creatures but don't fear them. Take proper precautions and don't do dumb things or things you are not comfortable with.

My wife doesn't ask for any explanations. She knows this is what I do and love so is supportive. I take a PLB, much more reliable than other devices. I don't carry any sort of "check in" device and won't. IMO that just causes more problems as evidenced by the thread this week with a worried spouse when the message doesn't come in on time. She knows where we park and the general areas we hunt. We can be found if there is an emergency at home.

I don't think going into the backcountry is really all that dangerous. Lets be realistic. Most of us aren't really roughing it so to speak. We have thousands of dollars worth of high tech gear and communication devices.

I think there is a lot more romanticizing about danger in the back country than reality.
 

William Hanson (live2hunt)

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Missouri
I just got back from my first back country elk hunting trip and honestly don't know how I've gone without it this long. I have a wife, a son and daughter on the way. I miss my family terribly while away but can say with certainty that I want to go out with my boots on. I want to die doing what I love whether it be chasing elk on a mountain or trying to get my arrow to reach its target on a missouri whitetail. My wife may not understand, hopefully my son and daughter will one day but either way it doesn't change who I am.
 

209hunter

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Jul 4, 2014
Messages
287
You have to do something that drives you in life. For me, it's backcountry backpack hunting and waterfowling. Anything worth pursing has its risks. Whether its business, a relationship or pursing your passion. You just have to decide if it's worth those risks. When it comes to mountain hunting I'm willing to take those risks every time. I never go into the wilderness unprepared and I always try to make the safest decisions when Im out there. But I have to be out there. This life style is a unique one and there arent many of us out there. I think for most of us, we're out there for similar reasons and the actual taking of game is lower on the list of reasons. I pray I never put my family through what these families are going through. But hopefully they understand why their loved ones had to be out there. Right now Im young, single and have a good job which allows me to hunt quite a bit. I dont hate my job, but its not what I live for. Therefore if I dont make it out into the mountains or out into the duck pond, I'd live a very unfulfilling life. I just hope those that I love understand that this is something I need to do.
 
Joined
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Anyone who hunts in the backcountry knows or should know the risks. We all have that voice inside that warns us when we are overstepping our capabilities or are in danger. For those who have been in combat, It's that same voice that tells you lets you know that shi$ is about to hit the fan. The key is to listen to that voice and not lose your wits when you see your dream animal. I know that sounds good but it something to think about when you see that animal. I've stopped several times when looking at animals when I realized there was no way I could get the animal out if I connected. I'll be the first to admit I don't always have my wits and last year on an animal I doubled my trips due to the danger getting the animal out. I The death of tj hit home for me as well. I toldy wife about it as well. I hunt solo for the test it gives me. I think everyone should test themselves to find and push their limits. My wife knows that but she knows I do my best to be safe. She always tells me "don't do anything stupid". With two kids who are daddy's kids, I know what would happen if I didn't come
off the mountain. I keep that mind and have turned around a few times on some paths. I love spending time up in the mountains and usually do some sort of trip every other month. My wife knows what it does for me, but expects me to be somewhat "safe". With a wife and two little ones, I expect the same out of me as well. Kinda rambling here so I will stop.
 

Becca

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The risks aren't a reason not to go, and I would be the last person to discourage a person from getting out there. But there are more important things in the world than hunting....having a good communication device can help a family make a decision about what is best for them under the circumstances. A good friend left our remote AK moose camp early this week after his wife (who is 22 weeks pregnant) was found to need emergent surgery.
"Sure, she would have survived the emergency procedure without him there (although I am sure she, their unborn baby, and their 5 and 4 year old sons appreciated the support), but if the technology exists to let them communicate every day, why be without it? I don't consider him less of a hunter for taking off early to be with his wife when she needed him. In fact, I consider it a miracle that they had the technology to discuss what was going on and give him the opportunity to head home early when his family needed him. I suppose I should mention that he already had a moose and a caribou down when this all transpired, but I honestly feel it is irrelevant.

I see both sides of this discussion, as I am frequently the hunter in the field (unreachable for weeks on end) and also sometimes the wife left at home waiting for the call to tell me "we are ok". While all contingencies can't be avoided, I think the duty falls to all of us to avoid unnecessary risks, and be as available to the loved ones who might need us as is logistically possible. Hunting is a huge part of who I am, but it certainly will never take priority over my role as a wife, daughter, or possibly someday a mother.
 
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pacific-23

Lil-Rokslider
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Feb 14, 2013
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Sitka
Well said Becca! We owe it to everyone in our lives (including ourselves) to maintain balance and perspective in what we do. I still remember the first hunt after I found out we were expecting, I got cliffed out and climbed though a bunch of brush with my fingernails. I've never been one for heights or exposure, but having that feeling of responsibility gnawing at me really changed how I thought about things. I will be going solo for goats Monday. My wife hates it, honestly I don't really like it either, but it is more practical than having to align my schedule and expectations with someone else. Will I be as headlong as I would be with a partner? No, but I'll also have the extra reward possible of having gotten things done solo. I never can forget though that married or not, none of us are really doing things solo completely, we're not an island, and there are people counting on or caring for us at home. It's hard to be well adjusted and maintain perspective! (At least for me)
 

William Hanson (live2hunt)

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I agree, well said Becca. I found on my recent hunt my wife and myself had the ability to communicate most of the hunt and we both found it very difficult when I was out of service range. My wife is also 26 weeks pregnant, which bore some influence on the difficulty but the real kicker for me was not being able to tell my little guy good night because he is to little to understand why I'm gone he just misses his daddy. So I guess I didn't mean before that I would hunt at all cost because I am a father and husband first.
 

Stid2677

WKR
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Sep 13, 2012
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The ram I shot this year "came back from the dead" :) and while he was dead and did not yet know it, he proceeded up into the most nasty stuff I have ever personally traversed. As I neared his resting place high up a slick granite waterfall, my buddy who has a wife and child slipped and fell and no longer felt comfortable going ahead.

I had wounded the ram and my family is all grown, I was willing to take way more risk than he, as it should be. I was responsible for letting the ram get into that spot and my responsibility to finish what I started. But there was times when a fall would have resulted in great bodily harm.

I told him to stay put if he was not comfortable, while breaking him down alone would have been much harder I would have got it done. If I had ask him to do more than he was comfortable with and he fell, I could not live with that.

Gravity kills,,, and while life is filled with risk, I personally am never more alive than when treading that fine line.
 

5MilesBack

"DADDY"
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I am an adrenaline junky. My wife knew that going in, my kids have learned that along the way. They just know that's who I am. They understand the risks, they understand the possible outcomes. While they don't hope for the worst (perhaps:eek:), they understand life in general. We're all dieing, just depends where we are on the timeline. Problem is.........nobody except God knows what that timeline is. I and my family are all secure in our eternal fates, and I believe that's why we/they really have no problems with facing death. That sure puts a different perspective on death............as well as life. Many of life's burdens and problems that people spend an inordinate amount of time fretting about, just wash off our backs. Sure makes life easier and much more worthwhile while we're here.......especially knowing that this life is the only hell that we'll experience.

My dad hunted a lot too. He and his partners never had any issues while hunting, yet two different hunting partners over his lifetime were killed in private plane crashes. Another friend was actually shot and killed while hunting with another friend. Bad stuff happens.......regardless of where you are or what you're doing. Looking back over my life, I could have and probably should have died many times over........but didn't. Everything is a tradeoff and there is a balancing point in life. I'm at that stage where I'd rather spend more time with my kids and their activities than fulfilling my desire and need to escape to the wilderness. But on the other hand, I only get a small window every year that we call hunting season.....and I take advantage of it. Everyone's balance point is different for everyone.
 
Joined
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Risks are in the eye of the beholder. What I consider a risk and what you may consider a risk are two very different things based on experience and knowledge. If I worried about risks I wouldn't ever go to bed because I'd be afraid of what the next day might bring. There are far more dangerous things out there than hunting. I can slip in the tub almost as easily as I can be eaten by a bear, but I don't stop taking showers.
 

Ranger619

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Aug 26, 2012
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MN
I know there are risks in the mountains, but probably the biggest risk we have on these trips is the long drives to and from the hunt.
 

djsmith46

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Mar 31, 2014
Messages
106
Respect nature and her creatures but don't fear them. Take proper precautions and don't do dumb things or things you are not comfortable with.

My wife doesn't ask for any explanations. She knows this is what I do and love so is supportive. I take a PLB, much more reliable than other devices. I don't carry any sort of "check in" device and won't. IMO that just causes more problems as evidenced by the thread this week with a worried spouse when the message doesn't come in on time. She knows where we park and the general areas we hunt. We can be found if there is an emergency at home.

I don't think going into the backcountry is really all that dangerous. Lets be realistic. Most of us aren't really roughing it so to speak. We have thousands of dollars worth of high tech gear and communication devices.

I think there is a lot more romanticizing about danger in the back country than reality.

Perhaps I'm not as accustomed to the backcountry as you since I just started "real" backcountry hunts this year. But I have never felt as vulnerable and humbled in my life as when I'm in the mountains alone. Its one of the reasons I like it and one of the reasons, at times it scares me.
 

njdoxie

WKR
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Apr 1, 2014
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623
I'm easily spooked coming down real steep terrain in the dark....so if I have that kind of trek, I get past the worst part while it's still light....I never cross that line, even though it has doubtless cost me opportunities. The closest I ever came to dying in the mountains was when I choked on a pistachio nut while eating dinner on a solo elk hunt....I came SO close to dying, that really scared me.
 

DaveC

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Jan 9, 2014
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469
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Montana
The closest I ever came to dying in the mountains was when I choked on a pistachio nut while eating dinner on a solo elk hunt....I came SO close to dying, that really scared me.

I have no doubt that a lot of the little, easily overlooked stuff is what will get many of us; both in the out of the woods.

This has been a hard year, with more than a few people I knew and whose judgement I respected dying in the woods. I like to think that when done properly, hunting, backpacking, climbing, whitewater boating, and so on are no more dangerous than driving to the office. I've stopped doing, or are very conservative with, activities were that doesn't seem to be the case (alpine climbing, free soloing, backcountry skiing). I could certainly be wrong here. I could also do what some of my late friends seem to have done, which is everything right, and die anyway because $hit happens.

I do think it's important to have an open understanding of the above with your family, and often think about how difficult that could be if my wife wasn't an experienced outdoorsperson herself.
 
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