Should I Nitride a Barreled Action?

[ThatDUDE]

I was wondering if any of you have experience with Nitriding a Barrel and Action? If so who would you recommend? Will it wear better then Cerakote?

 

[Marbles]

H&M Black Nitride. Give them a call for a quote.

 

[just browsing]

I'd highly recommend checking with the action manufacturer before doing anything - salt bath nitriding is done at very high temps and can have an effect on steel core ductility. In other words, you're re-heat treating an already very specifically heat-treated component - one vital for safety at that.

Personally I'd consider a coating like DLC or similar before aftermarket nitriding.

 

[dirtytough]

I have a few actions that are nitrided and one barrel. They were nitrided when they were new. I’m a fan.

 

[Marbles]

@fwafwow am I costing you money? Perhaps getting you in trouble with the domestic authority? Is that why you are angry?

 

[left hunter]

I believe I have done 5 complete rifles (all the steel components) and am very impressed. All have been done by H&M. All of my barrels have been either litely used or brand new and have had no issues at all. It’s awfully nice to not have to worry about rust inside or out anymore!

I had a Remington action screw done and just for a test a left it in the bottom of my cup holder in my truck for couple year without cleaning it. When I finally pulled it out to use for a project it was covered in junk (I’m sure spilled coffee, coke, etc). I wiped off and it still looked brand new. Pretty impressive to me

 

[fwafwow]

@fwafwow am I costing you money? Perhaps getting you in trouble with the domestic authority? Is that why you are angry?

Not yet - but I was innocently reading through the "new posts" and then am reminded of your recommendation. So far the domestic embargo has been successfully evaded a few times, but there are two large shipments of ammo that I sent to a buddy that are causing me grief. I didn't ask the seller to require an adult signature!

 

[ThatDUDE]

I believe I have done 5 complete rifles (all the steel components) and am very impressed. All have been done by H&M. All of my barrels have been either litely used or brand new and have had no issues at all. It’s awfully nice to not have to worry about rust inside or out anymore!

I had a Remington action screw done and just for a test a left it in the bottom of my cup holder in my truck for couple year without cleaning it. When I finally pulled it out to use for a project it was covered in junk (I’m sure spilled coffee, coke, etc). I wiped off and it still looked brand new. Pretty impressive to me

How does it hold up compared to cerakote? I have had a few actions where the cerakote has started to wear off in the action raceways and off the bolt.

 

[left hunter]

It holds up great but they aren’t really comparable. Cerakote is a coating while nitride is an actual change to the surface of the metal itself. Nitride doesn’t add any thickness to anything and treats the bore/inside of action that cerakote can never be applied. And honestly those are areas that you want rust proof.

And I don’t have any metal parts on anything cerakoted to compare to since cerakote only coats the outside which is the least important part for me to be rustproof. Kinda gives you a false sense of what’s actually going on

Even where the black color wears away you would still have the hardness/corrosion proof properties of the nitride on parts that are nitrided

 

[Marbles]

How does it hold up compared to cerakote? I have had a few actions where the cerakote has started to wear off in the action raceways and off the bolt.

Cerakote is more rust resistant. Nitride is more abrasion resistant, though the black is not really the treatment, it is a byproduct of the hardening.

You can nitrided, then blast off the black, the cerakote if you want to go overboard.

I decided to cerakote my action to avoid exposing it to the higher temps given that stainless is already weaker than cromoly (probably an utterly needless concern). I plan to nitride the bolt, barrel, and other components at some point. Having different hardnesses between the parts should make them run smoother.

I think a nitrided cromoly action with cerakote would be awesome.

Nitrided cromoly resists rust in a costal environment better than stainless in my experience.

That is my half informed take.

 

[hereinaz]

I had a Savage that had the Teflon coating, can’t remember what it is called, but man that made it feel nice. I don’t know how it would wear.

Given that, I would consider the DLC as a coating and nitride as a treatment.

I don’t think I would want cerakote inside my action or on my bolt seeing how it wears.

 

[Clarktar]

I'd highly recommend checking with the action manufacturer before doing anything - salt bath nitriding is done at very high temps and can have an effect on steel core ductility. In other words, you're re-heat treating an already very specifically heat-treated component - one vital for safety at that.

Personally I'd consider a coating like DLC or similar before aftermarket nitriding.

But who does the DLC coating anymore?

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[just browsing]

But who does the DLC coating anymore?

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

Try IonBond or CLUB Custom. No direct dealings with them either way, but they are the most popular ones mentioned.

I’d even consider cerakote elite before aftermarket nitriding… too many stories of receivers turning into eggshells because of improper heat treatment.

 

[hereinaz]

But who does the DLC coating anymore?

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DLC Coating - DNA Firearm Systems

www.dnafirearmsystems.com

Heard of them no experience.

 

[Marbles]

Try IonBond or CLUB Custom. No direct dealings with them either way, but they are the most popular ones mentioned.

I’d even consider cerakote elite before aftermarket nitriding… too many stories of receivers turning into eggshells because of improper heat treatment.

I've not found a single story, and I have looked.

The most I could find was that in destructive testing the guy who owns Mausenfield concluded the results were unacceptable. He is unwilling to share the details as it cost him time and money to learn them.

I heave found lots, and lots, and lots of claims stating it will turn make an eggshell out of the action, but nothing based on fact, only theory.

If you can point in the direction of fails actions, I would appreciate it.

 

[Choupique]

nothing based on fact, only theory

Yall have any idea what the nitriding process is? Temp/durations?

I did some metallurgy stuff once. I'd be interested.

 

[Marbles]

Yall have any idea what the nitriding process is? Temp/durations?

I did some metallurgy stuff once. I'd be interested.

Several hours at above 700 and up to 1100 degrees F, can be for longer times. Certainly could be enough that it could mess with temper and anneal the steel if done improperly. Looks like a lot of stainless anneals above about 1000 F.

A proper process, theoretically, Should not cause an issue. A process using higher temps and longer times could.

 

[hereinaz]

I've not found a single story, and I have looked.

The most I could find was that in destructive testing the guy who owns Mausenfield concluded the results were unacceptable. He is unwilling to share the details as it cost him time and money to learn them.

I heave found lots, and lots, and lots of claims stating it will turn make an eggshell out of the action, but nothing based on fact, only theory.

If you can point in the direction of fails actions, I would appreciate it.

Pretty sure my Nucleus is nitrided, made by Ted same as Mausingfield. I seem to recall a test like you mentioned. I think there was something specific he was testing and didn’t like about nitriding.

 

[Choupique]

I'll have to dig into it a bit. I can imagine there's a few concerns with high temperatures and salts.

 

[hereinaz]

Ted mentioned it in the Mausingfield product safety testing. It applies to aftermarket treatment of that action.