Savage 111 light primer strikes

[Runa541]

I have a Savage 111 chambered in 25-06 that is experiencing light primer strikes on about 25% of the rounds. All factory ammo (Nosler BT, Hornady SST and Interlock).
I’ve tried the usual suggestions: check headspace, clean and inspect the bolt assembly, accutrigger seems to be working normally.
While inspecting the bolt assembly, I noticed the cocking piece could possibly be catching on the bolt body, just enough to slow down the firing pin a smidge.
Has anyone ever seen this? If so, is the fix to touch up the underside of the cocking piece or just get a replacement?

 

[hereinaz]

I can’t see what you are talking about. Can you get a pic and maybe circle the problem spot?

But, Savage has always been easy to work with on repairs.

If it’s a burr or something, you could try removing it if you have a steady hand.

 

[WCB]

Is this randomly happening or all the time? Is this a newer gun to you and was fine and now it is happening?

Reason I ask is a friend of mine was taking his daughter on a hunt. He had a Savage 6.5creed and it shot just fine. When his daughter would go to shoot it she would randomly get "light blow misfires". I happened to have my Savage 6.5 crd along when a couple of these happened and looking at the primers no doubt light blows.

With a little testing/experimenting ends up she was putting side pressure on the main trigger and kinda of pulling them at the same time before the accu trigger blade part was completely depressed. This caused a click and the firing pin to move forward but not fast or deep enough to cause ignition.

Hard to explain but I can replicate it basically 100% buy basically pulling "both trigger" at the same time or basically riding the main trigger with pressure on it before the center trigger is depressed.

 

[Weldor]

Following

 

[Runa541]

Thanks guys.
For hereinaz comment, here’s an updated photo. The bottom edge of cocking piece’s “mushroom head” may be hitting the edge of the bolt body just a bit before the firing pin has completed its full travel.

For WCB, I believe my trigger pull is straight. I’ve had this gun since 2017 and did not have the issue for the first few years (maybe 60 rounds). I first noticed it after a rebarrel/rechamber from 30-06 to 25-06. I have also replaced the stock with an XLR Element. However, I did put the original 30-06 barrel back on for a brief time last year during elk season and did not have any misfires over 10-15 rounds while sighting in. The issue starting recurring again after I put the 25-06 barrel back on this spring.
I’ve verified the headspace on this barrel using go/no-go gauges.

 

[bojangles808]

I had light primer issues with my savage Axis. I sent it in and it would still be random until I disassembled and cleaned the entire bolt assembly. Hasn't happened last two range sessions so maybe it's better now but that gun stays as a backup in my safe, I don't trust it anymore as it cost me a couple animals.

 

[4th_point]

I didn't see it mentioned above, but have you measured pin protrusion?

 

[Runa541]

4th_point: no I haven’t measured pin protrusion.

 

[4th_point]

Let us know what you measure.

 

[Runa541]

Ok 4th_point. I’m now the owner of a Kynup caliper.


I measure pin protrusion at 0.052 - 0.054 using two different measuring methods.
From what I’ve read this appears to be correct per the factory setting.

 

[TaperPin]

I’d bet lunch the spring has become a little soft and needs to be replaced. Comparing the old spring style with the new I don’t think it was an upgrade - a lot more pressure on a shorter spring will shorten its life.

I bet the engineer that came up with this thought it was so cool to deviate from a design that’s worked for 100 years to save a few dollars.

 

[4th_point]

I bet the engineer that came up with this thought it was so cool to deviate from a design that’s worked for 100 years to save a few dollars.

That might actually be an attempt by Savage to improve shot to shot variation due to the spring mechanism affecting ignition. Or just assembly time.

I don't doubt that new designs can have issues or growing pains but spring selection for that application should not be difficult to design and test for.

 

[4th_point]

Ok 4th_point. I’m now the owner of a Kynup caliper.


I measure pin protrusion at 0.052 - 0.054 using two different measuring methods.
From what I’ve read this appears to be correct per the factory setting.

That seems good. I assume that one method was using the tail of the caliper for a depth measurement?

Did you ever mess with pin fall, or is the bolt as-is from the factory?

Also curious if you removed the ejector when setting headspace?

It seems that the only thing that changed from one barrel to the other were the barrels themselves. And headspace, correct?

 

[JFK]

I had a similar issue on a savage I own. Took the bolt apart and thoroughly cleaned it with brake cleaner. Very light coat of CLP, and it never did it again.

 

[willisp.72]

I had a similar issue on a savage I own. Took the bolt apart and thoroughly cleaned it with brake cleaner. Very light coat of CLP, and it never did it again.

 

[TaperPin]

That might actually be an attempt by Savage to improve shot to shot variation due to the spring mechanism affecting ignition. Or just assembly time.

I don't doubt that new designs can have issues or growing pains but spring selection for that application should not be difficult to design and test for.

You’re right. I just find it odd to change the design to such a short spring. For all I know it is just as reliable.

 

[Runa541]

That seems good. I assume that one method was using the tail of the caliper for a depth measurement?

Did you ever mess with pin fall, or is the bolt as-is from the factory?

Also curious if you removed the ejector when setting headspace?

It seems that the only thing that changed from one barrel to the other were the barrels themselves. And headspace, correct?

Measuring methods both used tail of caliper:
1. Measure pin protrusion directly (had to remove extractor to position the caliper)
2. Set the caliper on rim of bolt face. Measure distance to bolt face then measure distance to protruded pin. Subtract second value from first value.

Never messed with pin fall. Bolt is factory, except for carbon fiber bolt handle.

Headspace: I’ve set headspace twice, the first time without ejector, the second time with ejector. The misfires occurred in both circumstances.

Other changes aside from barrel: also replaced stock with XLR Element, but I’ve also used that stock with the original 30-06 barrel and did not have any misfires (only shot 10-15 rounds). With 25-06 barrel, misfire frequency is approx 25%.

Recently, I also put in a bolt lift kit from Desh Industries. Just one range session since install and still had misfires.

 

[Runa541]

Update: got a replacement firing pin spring from Gun Shack, but it is much longer than OEM. Their cs confirms it’s the correct part. I can (just barely) install it, but the cocking piece will barely budge using my fingers. I didn’t want to try to cock it using the bolt handle for fear of damage other components.

 

[4th_point]

Measuring methods both used tail of caliper:
1. Measure pin protrusion directly (had to remove extractor to position the caliper)
2. Set the caliper on rim of bolt face. Measure distance to bolt face then measure distance to protruded pin. Subtract second value from first value.

Never messed with pin fall. Bolt is factory, except for carbon fiber bolt handle.

Headspace: I’ve set headspace twice, the first time without ejector, the second time with ejector. The misfires occurred in both circumstances.

Recently, I also put in a bolt lift kit from Desh Industries. Just one range session since install and still had misfires.

FYI - standard calipers have a built-in depth measurement. When you open the jaws, the probe sticks out the other end. I call it the tail, but not everyone does. Anyway, rest the tip of the probe on the bolt face, and close the jaws until the scale body touches the firing pin. Super easy and fast, and a direct measurement.

If you are confident with the headspace, then I would move on. If not, you could shim the go-gage until it won't close and measure the thickness of the shim stack to confirm that nothing is amiss.

It's been a long time since I have owned a Savage, but I recall people sometimes having light strikes when dorking with the bolt lift. Not always, but it can happen with changes to pin fall.

If you dryfire the rifle, how much bolt lift do you have until you feel resistance? If you lift the handle a good bit with little resistance it indicates that the firing pin spring is not getting compressed until later in the rotation which could contribute to light strikes.

I'm sure there's a ton of information online for reference, which would probably describe it better than I am!