precision reloading... What press and dies do you use?

[Eric S]

Hey guys,
Ive heard that there is a difference between precision reloading and bulk reloading set ups. I will be loading .300wsm for what I hope to be a 1000yard rifle. Please point me in the right direction for press style and brand as well as a good set of dies.

Thank you, Eric

 

[Rucker61]

I'm not the experienced expert a lot of the guys are, but I suspect you'd want a neck sizing die for once-fired brass.

 

[JP100]

I use a RCBS rock chucker and full length Hornady dies for all my reloading.
Have found these to very consistent.
Im not a fan of neck sizing to be honest(alot of people might disagree). I dont really see the point when you can get good results from full length sizing. There is supposedly a case life difference but case life is still good with full length sizing I have found.
My view is you can get very good accuracy from most loading gear if you are careful and consistent with your loading and measuring. Careful powder measuring(not a thrower) and making sure the OAL is consistent.
I have found most accuracy gains/losses are from bullet seating depth. Powder and case prep makes a difference but not as much.
I mainly load for factory guns and all shoot inside 1/2 MOA I have one "match" grade barreled gun I load for and it shoots even better(better than I can anyway) which I use out to 6-700 yards(a .308).
For a magnum youl need a good strong press.
Do you all ready have loading gear?

Thats my ten cents worth anyway

 

[aron]

I have a Redding t7 turret press and use Redding type s dies. I also full length size instead of just neck sizing. I agree with jp100 that accuracy comes all from being consistent. Each press and dies seem to get the job done.

 

[Matt Cashell]

I run a Lyman Turret Press and have dies from Lyman, RCBS, and Redding. I prefer Redding Competition Dies.

 

[digger]

Just swallow hard and buy a Forester Co-ax press and redding dies and never look back

 

[Sam Millard]

I have tried just about every standard die available. I like Redding the best and use their full length bushing dies for all of my long range stuff. I full length size, with .002" shoulder bump and .002-.003" neck tension. I use their competition seating die as well, checking all loaded rounds for consistent length at the ogive. I was using a RCBS Rockchucker for a long time, but am going to try a Redding T7 turret for a while. I like the idea of leaving dies set up for multiple calibers. Between the kids and I, we get pretty busy loading during the season!

The name of the game in long range shooting is consistency. Good accuracy can be achieved at close distances while still having seating depths or charge weights off a little, but when you stretch it out, velocity spreads will eat you for lunch Make sure you have quality measuring tools so you can accurately check your loads.

 

[fire arrow]

Man my wife gives me a piece of her mind when I hit my reloading cycle. I'm showing her this ^^^^ picture and she will never give me grief again.

Put me in for a Rock Chuker and Redding dies.

 

[Shrek]

I'm using a Forster co-ax and I'm very happy with it. I had a Rock Chucker for years and it made fine ammo too but it wasn't anything special imo. I've steered clear of a turret press so far but the T7 redding is obviously making straight loads so maybe some day I'll own one. I'm with most of the others here who think Redding competition dies are about the best but I've had just as good performance from the Forster seaters and full length dies for about a third to half less money. I'm the odd man here using Lee collet neck dies to neck size fired brass. I also use a very old Lyman m5 beam scale that I had Scott Parker tune. I'm not in a rush when I'm loading so the speed of weighing charges isn't a priority. Gravity aways works. I use a cheap Lee powder thrower to throw a close charge and trickle up. Uniform brass , charges , and getting the loaded cartridge straight is the basic ticket. I've started shooting 7mm wsm and I think I'll have to start neck turning the Winchester brass . I'm using some mitutoyo dial calipers now but there is no way for me to tell if they are more accurate than my old rcbs calipers but they are smoother operating.
I don't think it makes any difference what press as long as it is a heavy duty press. A Lee classic cast to a Redding T7 or Forster Co-Ax they all will make good ammo. The dies matter for sure and the prep tools matter. I'm using a set of Stoney Point bullet comparators x2 and OAL guage. Wilson trimmer . I have a lyman case prep kit and a vld reamer and don't know of anything better to use. I had a FForster outside neck turner but I can't find it so if one of you guys who shoots and loads a lot has some experience with something better I'm all ears. Otherwise I'm going to order a new one.
We could discuss presses all day but what are you you all using for small tools. Dial calipers , trimmers , case prep , ect ?

 

[Broz]

I have tried just about every standard die available. I like Redding the best and use their full length bushing dies for all of my long range stuff. I full length size, with .002" shoulder bump and .002-.003" neck tension. I use their competition seating die as well, checking all loaded rounds for consistent length at the ogive. I was using a RCBS Rockchucker for a long time, but am going to try a Redding T7 turret for a while. I like the idea of leaving dies set up for multiple calibers. Between the kids and I, we get pretty busy loading during the season!

The name of the game in long range shooting is consistency. Good accuracy can be achieved at close distances while still having seating depths or charge weights off a little, but when you stretch it out, velocity spreads will eat you for lunch Make sure you have quality measuring tools so you can accurately check your loads.

I agree with Sam and I use Redding competition die sets. I prefer neck sizing my fired brass in the Redding comp neck die because it captured the entire case in a retractable sleeve and holds it true. Then the case and sleeve are raised up into the die where the neck bushing does its work. This I feel keep runout to a minimum.

The same method is also used for the seating of the bullet in the comp seating die.

I do body size and shoulder bump each firing. That is done as Sam mentioned by only setting shoulder back .002" from the chamber head space. When I run a case through my body die it only get sized where it needs it. If the shoulder is in spec the shoulder gets nothing. If it only needs pushed back .001" that's what it gets. I use Redding competition stepped shell holders to fine tune this step.

Over sizing that many less expensive dies can be guilty of still produces ammo but if it is oversized too far under chamber size you loose the benefit of hand loaded precision ammo. Oversized ammo will fit like factory ammo and usually result in a degree of accuracy loss.

Finally I use a T-7 Press and have for years now with 1000's of rounds loaded.

The onlt thing I like beter than my Redding T-7 would be my two T-7's.

Jeff

 

[Shrek]

After seeing the neat and well organized loading benches in these pictures there's no way in hades I'm post a picture of mine ! . I'm ADD from h#ll and my work space shows it !

 

[6mm Remington]

I think that's the prettiest darn reloading set-up I have ever seen! Man that is a nice job.

 

[Shrek]

I have owned and used Forster , Lee , Redding , RCBS , Lyman , and Hornady dies and for me the Redding Comp and Forster dies stood out for performance and feel and the Lee , RCBS , Lyman , and Redding standard dies were all about the same. The Hornady dies stood out as junk. Three different sets were all unsatisfactory. Rough sizing and the bullet seaters would hang up. I had to run them dry and lightly tap them constantly to get the sleeve to come down. What has been your experience and opinions and have you ever used more than one brand ? Imo , if you have only used one brand you can't have a comparative opinion. For those who've used several brands please give your experience.

 

[Matt Cashell]

Nice loading room Jeff!

 

[Sam Millard]

I started reloading in my FIL's basement with old RCBS stuff and NO measuring tools. I loaded for 270, 338Win, 44Mag, and 22-250. I got lucky a few years later and bought a complete RCBS set up from a guy at work...Partner press, 5-0-5 scale, powder measure, bench, and various dies, shellholders, etc. I think I paid $150 for it (1992 or so). From there, I just kept adding on or upgrading. I added a 10-0-10 scale, a Redding 3B-R measure, a Midway tumbler, and a Forster trimmer when I got a bonus at work one year.

I am also a garage sale nut and have found 2 complete set ups for cheap, mostly RCBS stuff, but also some Wilson trimmers and tools. I have 3 RCBS presses bolted down in the house and shop. I use one for nothing but de-priming (keeps the main press way cleaner!). They will all produce straight ammo. There is a difference in feel, though, between a Partner type press and the Rockchucker. While I haven't made ammo yet with the T7, it feels like the Rockchucker and the progressive plate is impressive!

I have used RCBS dies a lot. I quit using them when I needed a die set for a project and the local store only had a Redding set. Wow!!!! I don't need a wrench and a screwdriver to set my seating depth? I have since replaced or added Redding dies for all the chamberings I load for. I will say they both use that idiotic set screw against the threads thing to lock the ring down. All of mine have been replaced with Hornady or Sinclair cross bolt rings. I tried Hornady dies twice...hated both of them because of the interior finish and the stem/nut arrangement. I have ONE Forster Ultra die set for my 7WSM, but only because I couldn't find a Redding set anywhere. I still use the Forster seater, but have added a Redding bushing sizer to the box. No complaints so far on the Forster, though.

I have a Forster trimmer mount neck turning kit and a Sinclair neck turning kit (middle of the pack one). The Sinclair one is much better! I doubt I'll neck turn again unless I use a tight neck reamer on something, though. I turned a batch of (100) 260 cases to within .001 NT runout and noticed NO difference in accuracy or ES. I had cases that had .003-.004 runout that shot as well as the turned ones. A .25 MOA gun is just that and cured me of the "I've got to do something special" bug

For the guys just getting into the game...buy a digital scale now! There is no reason to use a beam scale when there are digital alternatives that make the job so much easier! I fought it and pissed and moaned about the "electronic junk" for a couple of years after the Chargemaster 1500 came out. Folks will say the beams are more accurate and so forth. How much and who cares is what I answer with. It's YOUR ammo. As long as your method allows you to make consistent ammo every time, it does not matter if your scale measures .1 or .2 grains differently than mine. Try weighing 500 bullets on a beam scale some time...get the digital!

I have been a professional mechanic for 25 years now. While Craftsman wrenches get the job done usually, Snap On wrenches kick their asses in every measurable way except cost. Over the years, I have handled some Lee tools from time to time. I get a "Craftsman" feel from them. The owners usually tell me how cheap they were several times during the visit...buy once, cry once!

 

[Shrek]

Sam of Jeff , I'm having a problem with seating depth in my 7mm wsm. I'm getting a spread of almost 3 thousandths while I get less than a thousandth spread in everything else I load for . Any ideas where to look ? I'm thinking it may be the uneven neck wall thicknesses causing it. I can visibly see the difference in necks and that is why I mentioned turning necks. Most are plus or minus one thousandth but thats more than double what I've come to expect. I'm used to shading a little to one side or other of a thousandth mark.

 

[Sam Millard]

I had exactly the same problem with my 7WSM. I could feel the ones that were going to run long when I seated the bullet. Some of them were .005" off. How much neck tension are you running?

My cases only had 2 firings on them. I was running .002" NT on them. I neck turned a batch of them to .002" RO, then tried my hand at hand annealing (never again!). In the end, I tossed the whole batch and started over with 150 cases from a different lot. I had a lot of problems with that original batch concerning QC. 23 cases out of 150 had the flash holes punched at an angle and off center and a few split necks. I took my chances anyway, but wish I would have sent them back. I know that would be a tough pill to swallow right now with the lack of components out there!

A work around might be to seat them all long in one step, then make a final pass to make them perfect. If you go that route, it will be a pain in the ass, but I would segregate them for lengths before the final seating.

 

[Broz]

One of the things I do to keep consistent seating depth with a T-7 and Redding comp dies is, set the dies up to contact the shell holder with a slight cam over. I do the same with the Redding body die for shoulder bump only with a bit more cam over. Doing this will insure the exact same stroke length each time. No worries if you are faster on one stroke than the next as the die bottoms out and the same depth is the end result.

ps: I also use Imperial dry case lube (graphite type) and dip the case necks before charging and seating. This gives a noticeably smoother feel to each bullet going in.


Not sure that is your issue Shrek but I thought I would toss it out there.

Jeff

 

[Shrek]

Sam , your two step method is the work around that I used. Wsm brass is basically non existent right now so I'll keep at it. I use a collet neck die and don't measure neck tension. Jeff , I'm using a Bonanza Co-Ax press which is a dead stop press without a cam over. Every seating I do is bottomed out.
I'm sending the rifle off to be rebarreled this week or next so I have some time. Maybe Winchester will run a batch of brass between now and my rifle getting back.
Have either of you had a barrel melonited ? I'm planning on trying it on this rifle when it gets back to extend the barrel life.

 

[Broz]

Shrek, I am still undecided on the melonite treatment. I want to believe in it but I have a few concerns. So I have not tried it yet. If I do ever treat one it will be on a high capacity case to bore rifle. Like my 338 Terminator. I am just undecided and waiting to get closer to some first hand experience before I pull the trigger. Maybe Sam has better info on that?

Jeff