Optics from scratch for Montana hunting for a newbie

[rentalrunner22]

I'm hopeful for this fall to not eat tag soup after the last 5 years chasing elk in MT. I've gradually and slowly grown my elk hunting knowledge since growing up hunting in thick timber in the midwest. My cheap binos, spotter, and potentially rangefinder are all getting upgraded. Last year after starting to glass finally, I've seen 100x the animals and finally accepted that hiking around with a gun isn't hunting; glassing is hunting.

I'd appreciate any advice for a good set of optics for elk, deer, and bear rifle hunting hunting in Western MT, primarily day hunts.

After a lot of testing friends and rental binos - I'm leaning towards the new Leica Geovid Pro 8x42s and Kowa 88 spotter. No budget.

I've demo'd the Maven 9x45s are they are excellent, but I think I'd really like binos with RF and ballistics for rifle hunting. I am near sighted and rarely wear my contacts while hunting, which leans me toward the 8x for FOV & handholding ability.

Any hesitation on this selection? Any reason to think the 8x42 Geovid Pros won't function the exact same as the 8x32 with a bigger objective?

My other idea is to get a Revic ballistic RF and Maven 9x45s. Which would be waiting until someone with alpha level glass makes some wind reading excellent ballistic bino.

I'm very much still learning how to effectively glass. I demo'd the Maven 18x which were also excellent, but I'm hoping I can long distance glass with a quality spotter, with a digiscope setup.

Thanks for all the help.

 

[GetWestern]

The 8x42 Leica's will serve you well for your described hunt style, same with the spotter all of which is top of the line glass. If you are really keen on having a RF binocular I would take a look at the EL range from Swarovski. Also don't overlook a good pair of 15x power binoculars those will go a long way for spotting especially for mule deer.

 

[Mag_7s]

I agree with the above, all you have mentioned will work very well, didn't see a tripod mentioned though. What's the colloquialism here...game changer I think it is.
I would probably lean toward your first choice. If 8x works better for you than 10x go with that. Like mentioned above, 15x on a tripod are also a good choice.
As for the rifle scope, that's some pretty tech stuff for me. I'd lean more on a NightForce NXS, NX8, or Atacr.

 

[Mountainrancher]

What is your max range for taking a shot with a rifle? Based on your post I’m assuming you’re new to western hunting and longer range shots. I know modern equipment, company’s marketing, and podcasts/social media make it seem like 500 yard plus shots are a piece of cake. But the reality is shooting that far takes practice and dedication. I understand you wanting ballistic capabilities in your new optics, as I was in the same boat in the last year. But when I realized that my shooting ability was not at a level that required having fancy ballistic solvers in my optics I opted for a simpler system until my shooting requires something more. So my recommendation would be to get a pair of maven binos in 9x45 or 10x42 and mavens rangefinder and use the rest of your budget to by as much ammo as you can and go shoot.

 

[handwerk]

I think you're on the right track. I've been using Geovids for years and continue to be impressed.

 

[Ernie]

Great choice with Geovids. I am using the 10X myself

 

[100 others]

Why don't you wear your contacts while hunting?

 

[Doc Holliday]

Better yet, get Lasik

 

[gr8fuldoug]

It's our pleasure, as a long standing supporting vendor here, to discuss the different available options and special opportunities with you. Please give a call, 516-217-1000, when you have the time. Thanks

 

[rentalrunner22]

Correct, I'm trying to become a well skilled ethical hunter this year.

I'm fairly new to shooting beyond 200 yards. I got a Tikka 223 this spring with SWFA 3-15 and have been shooting steel to 600 yards, about 200 rounds per month. Once I feel more comfortable at 600, the range has out to 1200 yards from various barricades and positions available. (PRS range). I'll probably keep doing that until fall. Will be building dope cards for my 223 as practice and my 7RM, then will be field testing. I plan to do a lot of mountain hikes/ shoot at rocks to simulate hunting this summer.

Sounds like I need to just get over putting my contacts in and just wear them until I get lasik.

Buying these optics won't inhibit any ammo or gun purchases throughout the year. I've saved for a decade and have a more than adequate budget to spend to be a well skilled hunter. I've hunted for years without binos, with cheap binos that make my eyes hurt, and a spotter that makes my eyes hurt. I'm interested in getting a good optics setup so that I can glass for hours to locate elk, deer, and black bear. I don't need to identify trophy game, I'd be happy with any decent bull elk, buck, bear, etc. I currently don't have the equipment that works for me to glass to locate them. I'm also interested in having equipment to help me make an ethical shot out to the capability of my 7 RM (~700 yds ish) so that as my skills grow, I don't have to upgrade. Currently use phone apps for ballistics, which works fine, but doesn't work well in a timely fashion when it's raining or snowing and I'm in gloves, etc. I'm interested in a faster/ easier ballistic solution that opening up my phone.

I may get the Maven 18x binos as well as a RF bino & spotter, but TBD. I'd like to try glassing for game with a good 8x or 10x and a spotter and see if that works for me. Not sure if it's realistic to regularly glass with a spotter (digiscope or single eye), or if I'll want to use big binos.

I've looked at the Revic tripod, currently have the Vortex ridgeline carbon tripod. Willing to sell and replace it.

Thanks everyone

 

[Banded_spooney]

Better yet, get Lasik

Lasik was the biggest game changer for me hunting.... I used to wear my glasses around and could shoot a rifle with them on but always found that if I was glassing for more than 30 seconds I took them off. -- hated them in the rain and I couldn't shoot a bow with them on looking through a peep. I had contacts literally just for when I was bow hunting. Normally, just went duck hunting mostly blind.

I'd pay 3x what it actually costed me to have the 20/15 vision I have now and its been 8 years.

 

[Ernie]

I wear prescription glasses, and more recently bi-focals - No problems for me.

I use a Holland level, and it has a hole, for me to attach a physical drop chart-Nice and handy.
I also carry spares-They don't take up much room. If I am hunting with someone else, they have one of my drop charts too. You can also tape drop charts to you stock, scope covers, etc...
Find a way that works for you and you can have your drops handy all of the time. It can make the difference between filling your tag, versus tag soup.
A good friend recommends memorizing your drops out to 500 yards (100 yard increments)

Wrapped around my ocular

 

[100 others]

Sounds like I need to just get over putting my contacts in and just wear them until I get lasik.

Yep, its a massive disadvantage not using them while walking around. I have a little bottle of contact-friendly eye drops that never leaves my binos harness.

 

[Ernie]

Thanks for all the help.

The specialty pistols from top to bottom:
7mm Dakota shooting a 180 Berger Hybrid right at 2900 fps
280 AI with the Holland Game Getter scope shooting factory ammo (140's at 2961 fps), and the load the drop chart is for: 160 grain AB at 2640 fps.
26 Nosler/Flame McMillan stock with 147 grain ELD-M at 3045 fps.
Pachmayr Dominator (1911 frame) chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor with the 140 A-Max at 2340 fps.
284 Winchester with the 162 grain A-Max at 2600 fps (Buck antelope)
7mm Dakota with the 200 grain Wildcat at 2700 fps (Leupold Mark IV)
6.5 Creedmoor XP-100 (red and black stock/mule deer) 142 LRAB at 2380 fps

 

[6.5x284]

In order I’d kit out starting new (and my preference for that item in order):

1) Binos (NL, Vic SF, EL, Geo’s) *go with 42mm obj
1A) Bino Harness (Marsupial, FHF, AG)
1B) Bino Stud (Outdoorsman or bust)
2) Tripod (Sirui ST-124, Slik 624/634, Promaster)
3) Tripod Head (Wiser Nighthawk, Tricer LP, VA5)
4) Rangefinder (Kilo 8k, Revic B4, Kilo 2400, 4000G)

5) 15x Binos (SLC, Meostar, Maven, UHD)
— or —
5) Spotter (Kowa 88S, Swaro STX 85, Kowa 774)


Spotter really isn’t needed for elk. If I was only elk hunting I may look at a set of 15x and ditch the spotter. If you get combo mule deer tag spotter can be handy. I’d honestly run a season with binos and tripod and a quick solving ballistic rangefinder like a Kilo 2400/8k or Revic B4, Vortex 4000B, etc… and see if you think you need a spotter.

Enjoy that first bull. You’re close. Find that sanctuary spot and glass jt!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Formidilosus]

Correct, I'm trying to become a well skilled ethical hunter this year.

I'm fairly new to shooting beyond 200 yards. I got a Tikka 223 this spring with SWFA 3-15 and have been shooting steel to 600 yards, about 200 rounds per month. Once I feel more comfortable at 600, the range has out to 1200 yards from various barricades and positions available. (PRS range). I'll probably keep doing that until fall. Will be building dope cards for my 223 as practice and my 7RM, then will be field testing. I plan to do a lot of mountain hikes/ shoot at rocks to simulate hunting this summer.

Sounds like I need to just get over putting my contacts in and just wear them until I get lasik.

Buying these optics won't inhibit any ammo or gun purchases throughout the year. I've saved for a decade and have a more than adequate budget to spend to be a well skilled hunter. I've hunted for years without binos, with cheap binos that make my eyes hurt, and a spotter that makes my eyes hurt. I'm interested in getting a good optics setup so that I can glass for hours to locate elk, deer, and black bear. I don't need to identify trophy game, I'd be happy with any decent bull elk, buck, bear, etc. I currently don't have the equipment that works for me to glass to locate them. I'm also interested in having equipment to help me make an ethical shot out to the capability of my 7 RM (~700 yds ish) so that as my skills grow, I don't have to upgrade. Currently use phone apps for ballistics, which works fine, but doesn't work well in a timely fashion when it's raining or snowing and I'm in gloves, etc. I'm interested in a faster/ easier ballistic solution that opening up my phone.

I may get the Maven 18x binos as well as a RF bino & spotter, but TBD. I'd like to try glassing for game with a good 8x or 10x and a spotter and see if that works for me. Not sure if it's realistic to regularly glass with a spotter (digiscope or single eye), or if I'll want to use big binos.

I've looked at the Revic tripod, currently have the Vortex ridgeline carbon tripod. Willing to sell and replace it.

Thanks everyone

With what you wrote, there is no way I would choose a separate RF and bino. The Bino LRF combo is a part of the shooting system. The time transition from pulling the binos out, putting them up, pulling the RF out, ranging, putting the RF up, then going to your rifle, then maybe pulling your binos or RF out again because the animal moved, etc, etc. is way more hassle and time.

The system to start with for western mountain hunting as you are describing it is-

- Rifle and scope that works without fail with sufficient practice (sounds like you’re doing this)

- RF bino binoculars.

- 15x tripod mounted binos- Meopta, Swaro, etc.



The spotter is for evaluating the animal after you found it, it sucks for glassing.

 

[rentalrunner22]

Appreciate the help Form. I'll send you a thank you card and a picture of my first bull someday.

 

[Rhyed]

Over several years, I have upgraded from Zeiss Victory HT 10x42 to Leica Trinovid HD 10x42 to Leica Geovid 10x42 HD-R 2700. I really like the Leica glass. It’s very clear even in low light.

I switched from Swarovski Z-6i to NF NX-8 4-32X50 a couple of years ago, which is a great scope. I’ll never go back to Swaro.

 

[Ernie]

With what you wrote, there is no way I would choose a separate RF and bino. The Bino LRF combo is a part of the shooting system. The time transition from pulling the binos out, putting them up, pulling the RF out, ranging, putting the RF up, then going to your rifle, then maybe pulling your binos or RF out again because the animal moved, etc, etc. is way more hassle and time.

THIS!!!

 

[Banded_spooney]

With what you wrote, there is no way I would choose a separate RF and bino. The Bino LRF combo is a part of the shooting system. The time transition from pulling the binos out, putting them up, pulling the RF out, ranging, putting the RF up, then going to your rifle, then maybe pulling your binos or RF out again because the animal moved, etc, etc. is way more hassle and time.

The system to start with for western mountain hunting as you are describing it is-

- Rifle and scope that works without fail with sufficient practice (sounds like you’re doing this)

- RF bino binoculars.

- 15x tripod mounted binos- Meopta, Swaro, etc.



The spotter is for evaluating the animal after you found it, it sucks for glassing.

I just can’t get past the fact that you can get better glass in your binos for less or same money than when you have RF binos.

I can’t afford it and will keeping running SLCs but I’d rather pay $600 less for NLs than having EL ranges. Can get a serviceable range finder for $600 and have better glass the 99.9% of the time you only need binos.

I also don’t want my electronics in my bino for service reasons. I’ve seen three people have RF issues in high end binos and even if they are serviced, then you are without your high end binos for sometime.