Just Moved to Arizona, Got Some Questions

[AME]

Hello all,

Just relocated from Montana to Arizona, and figured I would check in to learn a little bit about the environment down here, and possibly some gear that works well in it. I'm located in the copper basin east of Phoenix, and will be hunting locally, and probably in the north part of the state as well. I don't think I can get my residency this year, so I will probably just get a base hunting license and upland stamps (possibly a bear tag depending on how much time I have) for now.

My first question is to water. I am very unused to having little or no year-round water sources. From my (extremely) limited time in the area, it seems that unless it is a major river, lake, or reservoir, any body of water is kind of an overnight thing. So, for anyone in my area, do people hunt the backcountry, and if they do, where do they get water? I am talking more about extended expeditions a long ways into the hills than short one to three day trips. Is there springs or seeps that you can use a personal filter/purifier system at? If such water sources do exist, are they consistent, or mainly the result of recent precipitation? I came through Show Low on my way from Montana, and at elevation it seems like there is more water, but once you get below about 4500 ft, it feels very dry to me.

Second, to footwear. There are a lot of pokey things in this state, and I was curious as to what hiking/hunting boots you all have had good experience with? I need to buy a new pair, and would like to get something that is tough, not to heavy, and preferably leather. I believe that Jim Green footwear has a bit of a following on Rokslide, and I was wondering if anyone had tried their Ranger boots in this part of the country?

Third, weather expectations and its affect on game. This is less for this year, and more for future reference, but what is the trend for seasonal game movement? Does everything make for higher elevation in the heat, and if it does, what causes it to come down? From my understanding, the monsoons are the main weather pattern in the late summer/early autumn. Does a drier or wetter monsoon season have long term affects? I am primarily planning on archery hunting mule deer, so my questions more pertain to their habitat/habits. By the late archer season (December and January) have animals moved down from elevation, or does it not really work like that?

I probably sound like a bit of an idiot, and to be honest, this part of the country is so different to what I am used to I kind of feel like one. I appreciate your knowledge, thanks

AME

 

[Tony Nile]

PM sent

 

[Buckshotaz]

What area of Arizona are you in?

 

[fmyth]

Welcome to AZ and Rokslide. I live W of you near the Superstition Wilderness and have spent a bit of time in your area hunting and recreating. When I have a tag I use Onx and Flatline Maps of the unit to find "tanks" and springs. Sportsmen and ranchers have built water catchments, tanks (ponds) and wells all over the state. If we have a good monsoon all of the tanks will be full by late summer/fall which makes hunting more difficult as the animals will more dispersed. If its a weak monsoon fewer tanks will hold water, seasonal streams will be dry and many springs will stop flowing. This will concentrate the animals and hunters to areas where there is water. If you find cattle grazing there is water nearby and likely game animals. I wouldn't personally drink any ground water in your area as there are mines everywhere. I carry a filter in my pack but wouldn't drink any AZ ground water unless it was life or death. My coolers are always full of frozen gal jugs of water if I venture out to hunt or scout. My truck always has a case of two of water in it year round. My UTV always has a couple of gallon jugs in it. I don't do any backpack hunts here in AZ. The units I have hunted above and below the rim have tons of roads either built for mining or fire control. Even areas above the Rim like Show Low are very dry right now. In regards to boots the sharp rocks here destroy the soles/tread much faster than the places I hunt in WY, CO etc. I want a thick sole and leather to protect my feet from sharp rocks, snakes and the extra pokie vegatation here. I've had good luck with multiple pairs of Lowas w superfeet insoles. In my experience the units I have hunted here don't have enough elevation or snow to make the animals move which is much different from the WY/CO units I have hunted. This time of year I spend my time recreating above the Rim, with a couple million other valley dwellers. From October-May I spend my time recreating below the rim with a couple million snowbirds. The best way to learn the units here is to get out and hike or get a Jeep or UTV and explore. I'd also recommend you get an Inreach. Lots of ways to get yourself in trouble here.

 

[AME]

What area of Arizona are you in?

I am east of Phoenix about 2 hours

 

[AME]

Welcome to AZ and Rokslide. I live W of you near the Superstition Wilderness and have spent a bit of time in your area hunting and recreating. When I have a tag I use Onx and Flatline Maps of the unit to find "tanks" and springs. Sportsmen and ranchers have built water catchments, tanks (ponds) and wells all over the state. If we have a good monsoon all of the tanks will be full by late summer/fall which makes hunting more difficult as the animals will more dispersed. If its a weak monsoon fewer tanks will hold water, seasonal streams will be dry and many springs will stop flowing. This will concentrate the animals and hunters to areas where there is water. If you find cattle grazing there is water nearby and likely game animals. I wouldn't personally drink any ground water in your area as there are mines everywhere. I carry a filter in my pack but wouldn't drink any AZ ground water unless it was life or death. My coolers are always full of frozen gal jugs of water if I venture out to hunt or scout. My truck always has a case of two of water in it year round. My UTV always has a couple of gallon jugs in it. I don't do any backpack hunts here in AZ. The units I have hunted above and below the rim have tons of roads either built for mining or fire control. Even areas above the Rim like Show Low are very dry right now. In regards to boots the sharp rocks here destroy the soles/tread much faster than the places I hunt in WY, CO etc. I want a thick sole and leather to protect my feet from sharp rocks, snakes and the extra pokie vegatation here. I've had good luck with multiple pairs of Lowas w superfeet insoles. In my experience the units I have hunted here don't have enough elevation or snow to make the animals move which is much different from the WY/CO units I have hunted. This time of year I spend my time recreating above the Rim, with a couple million other valley dwellers. From October-May I spend my time recreating below the rim with a couple million snowbirds. The best way to learn the units here is to get out and hike or get a Jeep or UTV and explore. I'd also recommend you get an Inreach. Lots of ways to get yourself in trouble here.

Thanks for the info.

Any particular reason you wouldn't drink groundwater? Just out of curiosity.

 

[fmyth]

Thanks for the info.

Any particular reason you wouldn't drink groundwater? Just out of curiosity.

For me there is no reason to drink ground water as I am returning to my base camp each night. If I was backpacking in Superstition Wilderness I'd drink spring water from certain springs as it's known to be safe if filtered. I would not drink any ground water in areas where there are abandoned or active mines. The water in tanks is usually brown to dark brown in color and I've seen dead animals in them more than a couple times. As someone who has had Giardia before I am extremely cautious with water.

 

[eddielasvegas]

As the self-appointed chairman of the welcoming committee, it is my privilege to extend a laurel, and hearty handshake (virtual, of course) to our new AZ member, AME.


Eddie


P.S. I see you have joined two of the best forums now that you live in AZ. Good group of folks on both places, well except for @fmyth, he is a little sketch at times.

 

[fmyth]

As the self-appointed chairman of the welcoming committee, it is my privilege to extend a laurel, and hearty handshake (virtual, of course) to our new AZ member, AME.


Eddie


P.S. I see you have joined two of the best forums now that you live in AZ. Good group of folks on both places, well except for @fmyth, he is a little sketch at times.

Don't be picking on me just cause I live near Apache Junction.

 

[Weldor]

Get a copy of Duwane Adams book on glassing, good read while you wait for a tag. Hit up the guys at the Outdoorsman for glass recommendations.

 

[TSimons9]

Really solid info above. One more gear suggestion would be first lite sawbuck double front pants. They handle the thorns and rough brush better than anything else I have used but are much more comfy than a traditional carhartt double front pant. My absolute favorite hunting pants for AZ.

 

[olsont2]

PM sent

 

[AME]

Great info folks. Keep it coming. Best welcome to a new state I've ever got.

After looking at some of the regs, and my bank account/pto remaining, i'm probably only going to get one out of state permit (or whatever the OTC thingies are called here). Is it worth going after turkey in the fall? What are bears like fur-wise in the fall season? I think i technically could get an OTC deer tag, but it sounds like they pretty much sell out immediately, and I probably won't have the time for a whole lot of hunting.

My thought is to take a long weekend or two in October to camp fairly high, and hike just to get to know the country a little. I have a few units in mind that I might start putting in for once I am a resident, but would like to see them in advance. If I'm out and about anyway,I figure I could pack my bow, and maybe get a bear permit. Any comments? Thanks again,

AME

 

[azsupercub]

Hi AME,
Welcome to AZ!

Are you an AME (aviation wise)?

As to your questions,
Water... Carry what you need. Everyones needs are different, I am part camel and carry little, but I know the country I hunt, and pack accordingly.

As to the game, they know the country well. That drinker in my avatar is in the middle of no-where, but it gets ranched, and game know it. Between Game and Fish , and ranchers, there is an amazing amount of 'supplemental' water in this state, and that does not count the springs and trickles the game know exist. The critters know where water is, until you know as well, pack it.

Footwear is subjective. But yes, Everything in the desert SW bites, sings, pokes, or prods. Plants included. I wear boots unsuitable for walking distances when I ride, and boots unsuitable for riding when I'm on foot. Asses your mission HONESTLY, and choose accordingly. You'll be fine. No one on the 'net knows your feet better than you do.

Third, weather affects game far less in this state than it will affect you. The game has been here forever. A 115 degree day for a desert SW deer is business as usual. In our neck of the woods we have irrigation canals, and consequently summer finds deer 'swimming' more than usual, but none are leaving the area for 'high country'.

You really didn't specify hunt aspirations, couse are not muleys, and neither are elk or sheep. Specifics, might yield more 'specific' answers, but one thing I can share about hunting AZ as opposed to your home state is that most AZ units are a grid system of roads. This means;
A) you simply can't get lost with any reasonable directional skills.... You simply hold a heading for a mile or two and you cross a road. And
B) Everybody and their cousin will be hunting those roads. Get away from them. Preferably into wilderness area's where motorized vehicles are not allowed. Then you'll have a hunt.
What this also infers is that your best chance of success in a road riddled unit, exits on opening morning. It splits in half by opening evening, and falls apart after that, until the last day or two when all the roadies have left and the game has started to settle down again. Do your homework and connect on the opener, and make sure you have the last 2 days available as 'plan B' if you don't.

Welcome to AZ, it's not the wilderness, but the game management and genetics are not too shabby.

Take care, Rob

 

[AME]

Hi AME,
Welcome to AZ!

Are you an AME (aviation wise)?

As to your questions,
Water... Carry what you need. Everyones needs are different, I am part camel and carry little, but I know the country I hunt, and pack accordingly.

As to the game, they know the country well. That drinker in my avatar is in the middle of no-where, but it gets ranched, and game know it. Between Game and Fish , and ranchers, there is an amazing amount of 'supplemental' water in this state, and that does not count the springs and trickles the game know exist. The critters know where water is, until you know as well, pack it.

Footwear is subjective. But yes, Everything in the desert SW bites, sings, pokes, or prods. Plants included. I wear boots unsuitable for walking distances when I ride, and boots unsuitable for riding when I'm on foot. Asses your mission HONESTLY, and choose accordingly. You'll be fine. No one on the 'net knows your feet better than you do.

Third, weather affects game far less in this state than it will affect you. The game has been here forever. A 115 degree day for a desert SW deer is business as usual. In our neck of the woods we have irrigation canals, and consequently summer finds deer 'swimming' more than usual, but none are leaving the area for 'high country'.

You really didn't specify hunt aspirations, couse are not muleys, and neither are elk or sheep. Specifics, might yield more 'specific' answers, but one thing I can share about hunting AZ as opposed to your home state is that most AZ units are a grid system of roads. This means;
A) you simply can't get lost with any reasonable directional skills.... You simply hold a heading for a mile or two and you cross a road. And
B) Everybody and their cousin will be hunting those roads. Get away from them. Preferably into wilderness area's where motorized vehicles are not allowed. Then you'll have a hunt.
What this also infers is that your best chance of success in a road riddled unit, exits on opening morning. It splits in half by opening evening, and falls apart after that, until the last day or two when all the roadies have left and the game has started to settle down again. Do your homework and connect on the opener, and make sure you have the last 2 days available as 'plan B' if you don't.

Welcome to AZ, it's not the wilderness, but the game management and genetics are not too shabby.

Take care, Rob

I am not an AME in the aviation sense (actually didn't know about that use of the abbreviation until your post).

Thanks again for the info/advice. A follow up questions if I may:

When you say 'wilderness areas' in your option 'b', are you specifically saying legislated wilderness areas? Or just generally anywhere it is difficult to get vehicles?

Also, as far as hunt aspirations, I think I will probably focus mostly on archery mule deer, but would also like to kill a coues while I am down here. I will probably start building elk points once I become a resident, and same for sheep. But considering the amount of time it takes to draw either of those, and the nature of my work, I may not be in state long enough to get a really good elk tag or any sheep tag.

 

[GSPHUNTER]

Always remember, It's a dry heat. kind of like opening your oven door and sticking your head in.

 

[CorbLand]

I am not an AME in the aviation sense (actually didn't know about that use of the abbreviation until your post).

Thanks again for the info/advice. A follow up questions if I may:

When you say 'wilderness areas' in your option 'b', are you specifically saying legislated wilderness areas? Or just generally anywhere it is difficult to get vehicles?

Also, as far as hunt aspirations, I think I will probably focus mostly on archery mule deer, but would also like to kill a coues while I am down here. I will probably start building elk points once I become a resident, and same for sheep. But considering the amount of time it takes to draw either of those, and the nature of my work, I may not be in state long enough to get a really good elk tag or any sheep tag.

You always have a chance at a tag down there. Apply for sheep and elk, you never know. I have drawn two good tags in AZ back to back and with very low points. I am also a NR.

Always remember, It's a dry heat. kind of like opening your oven door and sticking your head in.

And the sun is no joke. It zaps you and does so fast.

 

[AME]

Always remember, It's a dry heat. kind of like opening your oven door and sticking your head in.

Sooo....bring some cookie dough is what I am hearing

 

[azsupercub]

When you say 'wilderness areas' in your option 'b', are you specifically saying legislated wilderness areas? Or just generally anywhere it is difficult to get vehicles?

Also, as far as hunt aspirations, I think I will probably focus mostly on archery mule deer, but would also like to kill a coues while I am down here. I will probably start building elk points once I become a resident, and same for sheep. But considering the amount of time it takes to draw either of those, and the nature of my work, I may not be in state long enough to get a really good elk tag or any sheep tag.

Yes, although this largely depends on your hunting style and preferences.

If you are a 'big base camp, with generator and margarita blender on the buffet table' style, and there's nothing wrong with that, then this suggestion is probably a moot point.

OTOH, if you are a more reserved, small footprint pack in, pack out style hunter, I think you'll find that hunting where mechanized vehicles are not allowed, and are willing to push in a few miles, you'll cut your 'spook factor' by an order of magnitude, and consequently extend that point at which game have completely abandoned their 'normal' habits similarly. Inevitably there will be one or two folks that are either ignorant of regs and boundaries, or just flat out bandits, but nevertheless, a random Polaris or truck is going to push animals far less than a constant drone of road hunters.

Conversely, if you use the 'drive' factor of others to your benefit, then this idea may also be a moot point for you.

You always have a chance at a tag down there. Apply for sheep and elk, you never know. I have drawn two good tags in AZ back to back and with very low points. I am also a NR.

And the sun is no joke. It zaps you and does so fast.

This is solid ... Make sure you really understand how the draw system works, it is not the same as most other states. I can't tell you how many seasoned veteran hunters I know, that truly don't understand the draw system. I know more than one that put the same unit number for multiple choices, because that's the unit they want, and more than that who put dream hunts for all 5 slots, and then don't understand why they don't draw? learn it and plan your hunt strategies accordingly. Unless you are absolutely stuck on one of a very few elk units / seasons, there is no reason you shouldn't draw an elk tag every few years, and it is absolutely plausible (though not likely) to draw on your very first application ever. To increase your odds of hunting, you have to asses your goal and apply in a fashion that capitalizes on that.

Also, again, study the archery tags. In my unit, as in many, deer are OTC. You can buy a tag at WalMart. Yes, you need to make sure the unit quota is not filled out, but this infers that YOU can hunt mulies this season and have as good of a chance at skewering a good buck as anyone else willing to do their homework / legwork. And we have no shortage of 'good bucks'.


Take care, Rob