Hammer bullets keyhole?

[Tremain4414]

Hello all,

So I am extremely new to reloading but decided I’d take the leap and work up a load for my 1/9 twist 300 win mag built by Oregon mountain rifle. I was having a ridiculously hard time finding a factory load this gun liked to shoot which I why I took the plunge into hand loading.

With the help of a buddy who’s been reloading for 5+ years, I worked through the ladder test and found a good node at 78.5 grains of H1000 with the 199 hammer hunters. Velocity is between 3121 and 3140 FPS.

My question is that I’m seeing paper tears around the edges of the bullet hole that make me think the round may not be completely stable. I looked at several examples of “keyhole” bullet strikes which all appear to basically be broadside strikes of the bullet into paper, not what I’m seeing.

Based on what you guys are seeing, do I have anything to worry about or should I keep loading them and go hunt? Thanks for any and all advice!

 

[nhyrum]

The bullets are plenty stable. Check out the jbm ballistics stability calculator. Don't with about it

Sent from my SM-G996U using Tapatalk

 

[Legend]

I had to do a ladder set around seating depth to get the hammer bullet to perform. But now it shoots great. I bet you can improve a fair bit with seating depth.

 

[Tremain4414]

I definitely have, that’s just an initial picture from one of the first tests I did. I’ve since been able to clean that up into 1/2-3/4 Moa groups, which honestly is as good as I’m able to shoot. I’m completely happy with their accuracy, just want to make sure they’re stable enough to hunt with

 

[Northpark]

That’s right in there where my hammer 199s shoot out of my .300 win mag. You should be all set in stability. Oddly enough mine seem to shoot better at distances past 200 yards. For instance I shot a 1.5 inch group at 200 yards the other day then proceeded to shoot a 1.1” group at 300 yards. Almost like they take a few hundred yards to settle in.

 

[Tremain4414]

I shot a 200 yard group yesterday at 1.4 Inch actually as well. I’m pretty consistently seeing at least 3/4 Moa accuracy at 100, and the best group I’ve been able to do is 1/2, but again that’s about the best I’m able to shoot. I’m hoping in the next few weeks to push it out to 500 and see how they do but I have zero complaints so far!

 

[Tremain4414]

I had to do a ladder set around seating depth to get the hammer bullet to perform. But now it shoots great. I bet you can improve a fair bit with seating depth.

Just out of curiosity, how far off of the lands are you seated? Right now my COAL is at 3.587 I believe and I’m .003 off the lands (sorry don’t have my notebook in front of me)

 

[Legend]

Just out of curiosity, how far off of the lands are you seated? Right now my COAL is at 3.587 I believe and I’m .003 off the lands (sorry don’t have my notebook in front of me)

I started at .005 and found the best performance at .030 off the lands. Quite a bit of a jump, but who am I to judge what a bullet likes under pressure. This was in a 300wsm with 168 HHunters.

 

[Tremain4414]

Interesting…I haven’t played around with seating depth much but definitely plan on it after the season

 

[Johnc427]

Looks great! I'm more impressed you're able to get 3100+ w/ H1000 and Win Mag. Can you tell me more about your load and rifle? Barrel length, Brass, COAL, etc..

I'm running 199 Hammers w/ 77 Gr H1000 and it's running right around 2930... 3100 sound a lot cooler lol

I shot mine at 500 yards last night and it's right around 3". Using .299 G7 BC the Applied Ballistics calculator was spot on. Up 8.5 MOA. Good luck!

 

[Tremain4414]

I’m using new ADG brass and federal 215 primers. My rifle is an Oregon Mountain Rifle with a 26” 1/9 carbon fiber wrapped barrel.

My coal is 3.587 right now (.003 off the lands). I have the base to ogive written down at home but can’t remember it off the top of my head. Im planning on playing with seating depth a little this weekend just to see what happens. This is my first foray into load development so I figured even if it doesn’t make much difference, at least it’ll be decent experience

 

[Tremain4414]

I actually started load development at 73.0 grains and worked up to 79.0 in half grain increments (3 rounds each). Mostly because I was excited to start reloading and figured why not lol. I didn’t see any real pressure signs until 79.0 when I saw extractor marks and had heavy bolt lift so I backed off

 

[tdot]

I've had several Hammer bullets that were right at the minimum recommend twist, produce weird wounding patterns on animals. IMO borderline or marginal in-flight stability does not relate to terminal stability within an animal. I didn't see any signs of instability on targets, so I thought I was good.

May be worth checking the twist in your barrel, they arent always as advertised.

I've dropped weight classes in all of the cartridges that I use Hammer's to hunt with and the terminal effectiveness of the Hammer's has only increased.

 

[Tremain4414]

I've had several Hammer bullets that were right at the minimum recommend twist, produce weird wounding patterns on animals. IMO borderline or marginal in-flight stability does not relate to terminal stability within an animal. I didn't see any signs of instability on targets, so I thought I was good.

May be worth checking the twist in your barrel, they arent always as advertised.

I've dropped weight classes in all of the cartridges that I use Hammer's to hunt with and the terminal effectiveness of the Hammer's has only increased.

That’s kinda what I was worried about as well. I love the idea of a big heavy 199 gr bullet moving at 3100 FPS but not if they’re not completely stable. I also think I may shoot them at targets which are a little thicker than the flimsy paper I’ve been using and see what that does. The targets I’m shooting now are so thin a light wind will tear the corners near where I stapled it, so I’m not sure if that’s a possible cause in the weird not perfectly round holes I’m seeing.

 

[Johnc427]

Copy that. Thanks for the info. Use cardboard, that seems to work good. I’m running a 1:9 Brux and haven’t seen any signs of instability with the 199….

 

[tdot]

That’s kinda what I was worried about as well. I love the idea of a big heavy 199 gr bullet moving at 3100 FPS but not if they’re not completely stable. I also think I may shoot them at targets which are a little thicker than the flimsy paper I’ve been using and see what that does. The targets I’m shooting now are so thin a light wind will tear the corners near where I stapled it, so I’m not sure if that’s a possible cause in the weird not perfectly round holes I’m seeing.

I'll bet you'd be extremely happy at the results of the 166HH at the speeds a 300wm would drive them at (3300-3400fps?).

I've used the 152HH in a 308win on Bear and mule deer... fantastic results. I just put my sheep down with a 7saum, pushing the 140AH at 3250fps and it was like it was struck by lightning. Double lung and I thought for sure I'd spined him the way he hit the ground. Speed+hammers is a great combo.

 

[parshal]

I ran 137 Hammers in a 7 twist 65SS and they were keyholing at 6000 feet. All the calculators show that to be stable. Brad said they've seen it before and that they pretty much ignore the stability calculators with solids. In other words, you may be stable or you may not.

 

[Humboldt]

I'll bet you'd be extremely happy at the results of the 166HH at the speeds a 300wm would drive them at (3300-3400fps?).

I've used the 152HH in a 308win on Bear and mule deer... fantastic results. I just put my sheep down with a 7saum, pushing the 140AH at 3250fps and it was like it was struck by lightning. Double lung and I thought for sure I'd spined him the way he hit the ground. Speed+hammers is a great combo.

Hey there. Would you mind sharing your load data and twist rate for your 308? Thanks!

 

[MT257]

Put that target on a thick piece of cardboard and the excessive tears I’m guessing will go away.

 

[tdot]

Hey there. Would you mind sharing your load data and twist rate for your 308? Thanks!

I don't have the rifle anymore and the notes are packed away in some moving boxes. It was a Kimber Montana, so whatever that stock twist is. I had a load with Varget, it wasn't fast, but it was accurate. Check out Long Range Hunting in the reloading section, there is a thread that contains a ton of the reloading data.