Can't figure out what's wrong..

Joined
Aug 17, 2015
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Location
Iowa
Long story but I'll try to make it as short as possible.. Last fall I bought a Bergara B-14 hunter, shot it on paper a couple times and was very happy with the groups.. I have two friends shooting the same gun and use 143 eldx and 41.5g H4350, so thats what I tried. These are all off a bipod and rear bag. The orange target dots are 2".

1st group ever with a vx-3:
8cASRcY.jpg


Upgraded to a Zeiss scope and this was the second group I shot with that setup after getting it sighted in:
mZW2tSe.jpg


Never shot the gun any more on paper but shot an 8" gong quite a bit anywhere from 100-300, and I've always been dead on. Even had one day this past spring that my stepdad, brother, wife (none of which had never shot the gun before) and I shot at the gong at 300 yards and everyone went 2/2.

Fast forward to this past May and I bought a (used) Christensen Mesa because I had always kinda had my eye on one, and sold the Bergara to a friend. Took the Zeiss scope off the Bergara and put it on the Mesa and went to the range with a bunch of different loads of 140gr accubonds (wanted to try them). Here were the results:

sZsnFw7.jpg


Then loaded up some 143 eldx loads and headed to the range..
CX5NKnc.jpg


Over the next several weeks, I shot quite a bit at the gong and was never overly impressed - maybe hitting it 40-50% of the time at 300 yards. Of course when you miss the gong, you can't tell where, so I wasn't sure what was going on. So a few weeks ago I decided to shoot some more paper and try to figure it out. Here is 100 yards - 1 is bipod with rear bag, 1 is just off a bag and no rear bag, and 1 is off the bipod with no rear bag - I can't remember which is which now, but it doesn't make much difference as they are all sub-par.
KEy5hIb.jpg


After that, I decided to do more paper shooting with the gun a couple weeks later to see if I was just having a bad day, or something was going on, and here are those results..

100 yards:
95QQqiM.jpg


rgvxmCH.jpg


Talked to Christensen and they told me to send the gun in to get checked out, so thats what I did. I was frustrated with the whole situation and I was able to buy the Bergara back so I decided to just do that (never shot since I sold it to him). Got it home, mounted the scope, grabbed some ammo and headed outside.. This is now what my groups look like..
mhEmo63.jpg


Not any better than I was getting with the Mesa, and obviously way worse than I had been shooting last year and this spring. I can't figure out what's going on, so I'm open to suggestions. I concentrated hard on making good shots, not rushing, and all except maybe a couple felt good - like when you squeeze the tigger and can't wait to see where the hole is because you just know its touching the last one. Obviously the only variables are the gun, the optics, the ammo, and myself. The gun doesn't seem to be the problem, I doubt there is a problem with the optics (especially since its been mounted and remounted several times), doubt there is a problem with the ammo, so I'm guessing it's me, but what am I doing wrong?

Only variable that could have changed with the ammo between the good shooting and bad shooting is I switched from CCI 200 primers to Federal 210, but I highly doubt it makes that big of a difference.
 
ANY change in components CAN change the POI and a few other things too - Assemble some loads identical to the original good ones and shoot for effect is the only way to tell - shoot at least 5 shot groups
 
How consistent is your shoulder pressure? Cheek weld?

First things first, I’d try to replicate results with identical Ammo.
 
cornfedkiller,

You’re going to get a ton of guesses, however in all likelihood it’s the scope. Changing primers, cheek weld, shoulder pressure, old brass, the phase of the moon, etc. isn’t causeing 3 moa groups from two decent rifles.

Scopes fail way more often than most want to believe.
 
cornfedkiller,

You’re going to get a ton of guesses, however in all likelihood it’s the scope. Changing primers, cheek weld, shoulder pressure, old brass, the phase of the moon, etc. isn’t causeing 3 moa groups from two decent rifles.

Scopes fail way more often than most want to believe.


Boom.

Start here...
 
I've had primers change accuracy that much. Use the same primers as you were using and see if that gets you back to where you want to be.
 
I'm playing a similar game with a Model 70 and VX3i. Same thing - bipod and rolled up towel for rear. Gotta be me and the only thing that feels diff is my eyes and what I can see thru the scope.

Hope you get it figured out. Frustrating stuff.
 
Is the rifle assembled correctly?
Screws torqued appropriately?
Mounts installed and torqued correctly?
Action screw hitting the bolt head?
Scope mount screws deadheading on the barrel shank?
Mag box torquing the action?
Ammo run out, is it straight?
Scope puked?
Action bedded?

What does off the shelf ammo do? That’s a humbler right there.

How does it shoot on a rest instead of a bipod?

Can you actually shoot?

Flinch?

Has anyone else shot it?



Start at the start...I’d grab a proven scope first if it was me.
 
cornfedkiller,

You’re going to get a ton of guesses, however in all likelihood it’s the scope. Changing primers, cheek weld, shoulder pressure, old brass, the phase of the moon, etc. isn’t causeing 3 moa groups from two decent rifles.

Scopes fail way more often than most want to believe.

Is the best way to check just to throw another scope on and see if that fixes it?

Now that I think back, I'm pretty sure the load testing I did with the Mesa and eld-x was using the federal primers. But I'll get some CCI primers and try them again too.
 
Is the rifle assembled correctly? I assume so? Nothing on the rifle has changed since I shot it last spring.
Screws torqued appropriately? Yep
Mounts installed and torqued correctly? Yep
Action screw hitting the bolt head? Nope
Scope mount screws deadheading on the barrel shank? I only assume I know what this means, but I did notice when I was mounting the scope back on that when I looked down in the furthest forward hole where the barrel threads are, the threads were crushed a tiny bit - but I assume its been like that since I mounted the scope last year.
Mag box torquing the action? Don't think so.
Ammo run out, is it straight? Not sure about this.
Scope puked? Definitely could be
Action bedded? Can't remember - but nothing that's changed since last spring.

What does off the shelf ammo do? That’s a humbler right there. Actually havent tried any. Hard to find anything decent locally.

How does it shoot on a rest instead of a bipod? About the same.

Can you actually shoot? I think so?

Flinch? I don't think so.

Has anyone else shot it? Not recently. I could give that a try too.



Start at the start...I’d grab a proven scope first if it was me.
 
“Can you shoot?”

Take that tongue in cheek 😉. Sometimes we overestimate our ability.

Been on both sides of that deal...
 
“Can you shoot?”

Take that tongue in cheek 😉. Sometimes we overestimate our ability.

Been on both sides of that deal...

Haha I completely understand. After shooting pretty consistent MOA or better groups and then going to 3+ on multiple outings, I figured there has to be something else going on. I realize we all have bad days at the range, but every day has been bad lately.

But I'll have someone else shoot it and see how they do if I don't figure something else out in the meantime.
 
cornfedkiller,

You’re going to get a ton of guesses, however in all likelihood it’s the scope. Changing primers, cheek weld, shoulder pressure, old brass, the phase of the moon, etc. isn’t causeing 3 moa groups from two decent rifles.

Scopes fail way more often than most want to believe.
Other than the primers this seems to be the common factor between the rifles.
 
I'd get the scope checked. When a previously accurate rifle suddenly goes south, I t's usually the scope, IME. Confirm integrity of rings/bases, and try the rifle with a known good scope. Sell the Ziess with fresh manufacturer's service...

Second- and absolutely no offense meant- how are you shooting other rifles? (Get some decent bags/rests.) If you don't already own both, get a 22 & 223. Shoot thousands in practice. A bunch of dry firing, 223 & 22 helps keep me sharp better than anything else.

Good luck. :)
 
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I've had primers change accuracy that much. Use the same primers as you were using and see if that gets you back to where you want to be.
the 2 primers mentioned are not too far dissimilar in brisance but the 210M IS hotter - IF that were to be the problem I'd rework the load to use the 210M's personally
 
Is the best way to check just to throw another scope on and see if that fixes it?

Yes, a solid scope. Also, if you have damaged threads on the barrel in the front base hole, shorten the screw until there is zero contact. That can, and absolutely will produce wild groups.
 
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