All Purpose Hunting Arrow

[Liosis]

Hoping all you pros can school me. This will be an all purpose arrow from coues to elk and I'm trying to find a good compromise between speed and momentum...a lot of spot and stalk running and gunning, so keeping some speed for flatter trajectory is important to me, but I still want an arrow that has no problem getting the job done on elk. I figure trimming weight in the shaft for speed while adding weight to the front to create a higher FOC may just be what I'm looking for. Have at it!

65 lb draw weight
28.5 in draw length

28.5 in GT Velocity XT 300 spine 8.5 gpi = 242.25 gr
Acculite nock = 8.3 gr
Blazers = 18 gr
Acculite insert = 12.4 gr
Additional insert weight = 20 gr
Slick Tricks = 100 gr

Finished arrow weight = 400.95 gr
FOC = 13.13%

Or I could run the same setup with GT Hunter XT 300 spine at 9.2 gpi for the following results:

Finished arrow weight = 420.9 gr
FOC = 12.5%

I like the idea of the additional 20 gr inserts because I already have 100 gr slick tricks and I can always change to 85 or 125 gr slick tricks if I want to weight up or down to change my FOC. The 300 spine is likely to be a bit stiff, but it seems like almost everyone prefers a little stiffer arrow than they actually need...plus I'd like the "extra" stiffness so that I can increase DW and maybe even BH weight without my arrow becoming too weak...is 300 too much, should I stick with a 340...I could remove about an inch of arrow length if I moved to 340's, but I prefer the longer arrow?

 

[OR Archer]

If those are the two shafts you have your interest in Id pick option number 2. I'm not a big fan of the Velocity shaft as a hunting arrow.

 

[ChadS]

If those are the two shafts you have your interest in Id pick option number 2. I'm not a big fan of the Velocity shaft as a hunting arrow.

x2 ^^^

 

[camelcluch]

/\/\/\ yep

 

[ChadS]

The 300 spine is likely to be a bit stiff

Not really an issue. I started a thread on here about being over spined

If I were you I would take a good look at Kinetics , Axis, Injexions, Black Eagles, DCA.

IMO it is better to carry weight through the entire shaft than to give up spine with hopes of increasing FOC

 

[SDHNTR]

I like option one, but with a 125 gr head. You'd have nearly the exact same arrow I do. And the Velocity Pro is a fine hunting arrow. I've been using it for the last few years and have killed at least 30 some critters. No complaints at all. You are not giving up spine at all with that set up and the best weight is carried up front. I went from a 7595 pro hunter arrow to the Velocity 300 with more point weight and the results have been superior in every aspect.

 

[Coyote Commander]

Check out the Black Eagle Carnivore.

It's a lighter 300 spine shaft. Run bookoo foc to get total arrow weight back up.

 

[Liosis]

Check out the Black Eagle Carnivore.

It's a lighter 300 spine shaft. Run bookoo foc to get total arrow weight back up.

The Black Eagle Carnivore is 8.5 gpi in 300 spine...same as option #1 above.

 

[Liosis]

I like option one, but with a 125 gr head. You'd have nearly the exact same arrow I do. And the Velocity Pro is a fine hunting arrow. I've been using it for the last few years and have killed at least 30 some critters. No complaints at all. You are not giving up spine at all with that set up and the best weight is carried up front. I went from a 7595 pro hunter arrow to the Velocity 300 with more point weight and the results have been superior in every aspect.

I'm liking the additional 20 grain insert weight because it gives me a wider range of options...like adding the 125 BH as you mention for some more FOC. It seems like everyone I've heard of who changed from the GT Hunters to the Velocities has echoed your opinion of it being superior in every aspect. I'm definitely leaning that way based on the opinions of people who have run both through their bows. What DW, DL, and arrow length are you using...you think the 300 spine trumps the 340 for my setup...considering I may want to increase DW and BH weight at some point?

 

[Liosis]

Not really an issue. I started a thread on here about being over spined

If I were you I would take a good look at Kinetics , Axis, Injexions, Black Eagles, DCA.

IMO it is better to carry weight through the entire shaft than to give up spine with hopes of increasing FOC

Not sure I understand...I don't think I'm giving up any spine, I'm just using a lighter weight 300 spine arrow so that I can get the FOC I want with less BH weight to still maintain some speed for flatter trajectory for spot and stalk coues. I don't know much about arrow physics, but I know that more BH weight equals "weaker" spine. If anything, I would argue that if you took the exact same 300 spine arrow set ups (even the same FOC) with the only differences being BH weight and arrow shaft gpi, that the heavier arrow would need more BH weight to achieve the same FOC which would actually result in the heavier arrow being "weaker" spined due to the additional BH weight on the same spines arrow...am I oversimplifying this? I'll try to find your post on being over spined...maybe I'm missing something about dynamic spine, etc.

 

[ChadS]

is 300 too much, should I stick with a 340...I could remove about an inch of arrow length if I moved to 340's, but I prefer the longer arrow?

I think this is were I got the idea you were conisering swiching too, or "sticking with" a 340 spine. Probably where the misunderstanding started.

 

[MattB]

Not sure I understand...I don't think I'm giving up any spine, I'm just using a lighter weight 300 spine arrow so that I can get the FOC I want with less BH weight to still maintain some speed for flatter trajectory for spot and stalk coues. I don't know much about arrow physics, but I know that more BH weight equals "weaker" spine. If anything, I would argue that if you took the exact same 300 spine arrow set ups (even the same FOC) with the only differences being BH weight and arrow shaft gpi, that the heavier arrow would need more BH weight to achieve the same FOC which would actually result in the heavier arrow being "weaker" spined due to the additional BH weight on the same spines arrow...am I oversimplifying this? I'll try to find your post on being over spined...maybe I'm missing something about dynamic spine, etc.

FOC is a grossly overvalued metric which IMO causes people to make bad equipment decisions - especially for selecting an arrow to fully penetrate a light animal like a coues buck. Use a durable shaft, select a BH that results in the proper dynamic spine, and go hunt.

 

[Rick Leathley]

FOC is a grossly overvalued metric which IMO causes people to make bad equipment decisions - especially for selecting an arrow to fully penetrate a light animal like a coues buck. Use a durable shaft, select a BH that results in the proper dynamic spine, and go hunt.

MAtt I'm pretty sure my VAP's are as strong or stronger then any other carbon shaft on the market. Most guys I know chasing higher FOC are shooting .250 to .200 spine like Gold Tip kinetics. I'm not sure why you think a FOC requires a non durable shaft I think you are misinformed.

 

[SDHNTR]

I'm liking the additional 20 grain insert weight because it gives me a wider range of options...like adding the 125 BH as you mention for some more FOC. It seems like everyone I've heard of who changed from the GT Hunters to the Velocities has echoed your opinion of it being superior in every aspect. I'm definitely leaning that way based on the opinions of people who have run both through their bows. What DW, DL, and arrow length are you using...you think the 300 spine trumps the 340 for my setup...considering I may want to increase DW and BH weight at some point?

I don't know about a trumping, but I see an advantage.

I shoot 68lbs at 28.5" with 20gr weight and a 125 VPA. Total weight is around 430. Pretty much where it was with .340 spine 7495, but I prefer the stiffer spine and greater FOC.

 

[MattB]

MAtt I'm pretty sure my VAP's are as strong or stronger then any other carbon shaft on the market. Most guys I know chasing higher FOC are shooting .250 to .200 spine like Gold Tip kinetics. I'm not sure why you think a FOC requires a non durable shaft I think you are misinformed.

Which .200 or .250 spine arrow cut at 28.5" would you recommend to achieve a high FOC arrow with a finished weight of 400-420 grs?

 

[Liosis]

I don't know about a trumping, but I see an advantage.

I shoot 68lbs at 28.5" with 20gr weight and a 125 VPA. Total weight is around 430. Pretty much where it was with .340 spine 7495, but I prefer the stiffer spine and greater FOC.

That makes sense to me.

 

[Liosis]

I think this is were I got the idea you were conisering swiching too, or "sticking with" a 340 spine. Probably where the misunderstanding started.

No worries, I just thought I must be missing something. I read through your thread about being over spined and agree that being over spined isn't much of an issue with today's compound bows. Thanks for the input.

 

[ChadS]

Thats why I jumped to the .200s from the .300s. I may have been ok with .300s but I would rather be over spined and KNOW I didnt need to worry about spine. I also will take all thw FOC I can reasonably get, but I am of the opinion that a heavy arrow with a lower FOC is better than a lighter arrow with a higher FOC as it relates for overall penetration qualities.

 

[Mmcan]

Thats why I jumped to the .200s from the .300s. I may have been ok with .300s but I would rather be over spined and KNOW I didnt need to worry about spine. I also will take all thw FOC I can reasonably get, but I am of the opinion that a heavy arrow with a lower FOC is better than a lighter arrow with a higher FOC as it relates for overall penetration qualities.

What would keep you from having a heavier arrow with a higher FOC? Run a strong enough spine and add weight up front? ((I am asking this question, not trying to be a wise guy. I've spoke with several local shops, and the answer they give is usually "you don't need that", but I think it pertains more to selling items they have in stock)

 

[cuerro viejo]

When you add more weight up front it lessens your spine so you either go up in spine or cut your arrows shorter.
If your over spined add more weight up front, underspined lesson weight or decrease shaft length
Most spine charts factor in 110-120 grs up from (BH/and incert).

Only way to really eye ball it as close as possible is ontarget software or similar. It will give you a good starting point and you can adjust arrows as mention above when tuning from there.

For majority of north american animals, you don't need high foc or high arrow weight. Espesially if not pushing the distance